Am I fat???

[JaderBug]

I've been concerned about Jade's weight. She stands 20" tall, is 25" long (from chest to butt), and has a 27" heartgirth. She weighs 45 lbs. My gut tells me she's overweight, but the vets in the past (she weighed 45 lbs then too) said she's alright. She gets 1/2 cup of ProPlan twice a day, and though she stays pretty active running around the home, I don't get her out as much as I would like to. She's 10 months old, too.

 

Also, excuse the crap and particles on the floor, still in the process of moving into the apartment, need to find the vacuum

 

 

 

 

Also, does anyone else's dog have weird butt hair like Jade's? It's so odd, I can't quite get used to it. It's quite a bit longer than the rest of her hair, I just find it very bizzare. I liken it to old-school mutton chops on her butt. Also, the hair on the top of her butt curls up all weird, like she's had rollers in them. Weird dog.

 

 

"What?? Don't you like my butt 'do?"

[Angie H]

Oh my goodness - NO, Jade is NOT FAT!

 

She has fuzzy butt...it's cute - not weird.

[bcnewe2]

I'm so glad you were talking about Jaderbug and not yourself! the butt hair was a bit to personal!

She doesn't look fat to me. and as for bed butt hair, 3 of my 4 bc's have bed butt! We like it!

 

Kristen

[JaderBug]

Oh my goodness - NO, Jade is NOT FAT!

 

She has fuzzy butt...it's cute - not weird.

 

I guess the general reason I ask is because to me it seems like 45# is awful big for a BC, especially a female, when a lot of other BCs I see in other activities are almost waiflike. I also kind of have a hard time feeling her ribs, feels like a lot of mush.

 

LOL I like her butt hair too... i think its weird but it's funny too

[bcnewe2]

She looks tall. So that could be the extra wieght?

I'm not good with real numbers and the dogs. I don't measure or weigh much. Dew is short, and looks allot like Jaderbug structurly except the height difference. They are not the waif model type but def. not fat! I would guess Dew's wieght to be around 30#'s but like I said she's short and has lots of hair. The hair that Jaderbugs got is also decieving on the wieght part. Hair looks like it adds wieght but it's all fluff!

[Debbie Meier]

Without feeling her condition it's hard to tell, she looks a little heavy for her leg but the hair can be decieving. Also, is she spayed? If so, she may always look out of balance some spayed females will develop a longer leaner leg then if they had not been spayed. If you are comparing her to the dogs you saw at Council Bluffs it is unfair to her, she has not reached that level of maturity and she is not operating at the same excersise level. Playing and running each day is not the same as going out and working stock regularly. Jake weights about 45 lbs, but he does not have an ounce of fat on him, his body measurements are about the same as Jade's, physical condition can have a lot to due with how the weight is distributed. (btw, Jake did not appreciate standing to be measured to verify his size compared to Jade's)

 

When I feel the condition of our dogs I expect to feel just a touch of rib and just a little back bone, I want good muscle on either side of the backbone (loins). I expect to feel their hip bones just a touch but not a lot and I expect them to be tucked up a little on their belly, when you run you hand under her belly I expect a definition when I reach the end of her ribcage, tucking up into her flanks. I had to take some weight off a couple of ours, they had a hard time handling their stock, when they got down to fit and trim mode their level of work improved greatly. I'd rather have to put weight on a working dog then to take it off.

 

As far as the puffy butt, have you ferminated her lately it looks like there is some dead hair in there? Also, our one rough coat Riley gets a funny plum on the top of her butt (over her hips like Jade has)

 

Deb

[juliepoudrier]

I also kind of have a hard time feeling her ribs, feels like a lot of mush.

 

If you have a hard time feeling her ribs, then she is overweight. You don't want to be able to see her ribs sticking out just by looking, but you should be able to feel them pretty easily with the lightest pressure on her sides. Someone here or another forum I'm on likened it to running your fingers over the back of your hand. I would say that "back-of-the-hand" thin is about as thin as I'd like to see a dog go. Remember that in most practices what vets see is overweight idogs, and that becomes pretty much the norm. If they don't have experience with fit working/athletic dogs, they might not be as quick to point out that a dog is overweight.

 

You should see a good tuck behind her rib cage, and in the above shot you've posted, I'd like to see more of an hourglass shape.

 

J.

[MaryP]

Remember that in most practices what vets see is overweight idogs, and that becomes pretty much the norm. If they don't have experience with fit working/athletic dogs, they might not be as quick to point out that a dog is overweight.

 

This is so true. Unfortunately, it translates down to the owners who then never really learn what a fit dog should look like.

 

I agree with everything else that Julie said, too, about how to feel for ribs. Photos can almost never give an accurate picture. You need to be able to lay your hands on the dog.

 

With that said, as a matter of comparison, my youngest dog, Skittles, is 22 inches and weighs around 47 lbs.

 

And, totally unrelated, but I'm constantly amazed at how small everyone's dogs are! Skittles is the smallest one of my dogs, but compared to most other dogs that people post about here, he's big.

[ragtimedog]

Remember that in most practices what vets see is overweight idogs, and that becomes pretty much the norm. If they don't have experience with fit working/athletic dogs, they might not be as quick to point out that a dog is overweight.

 

A vet told my my working/sleddog bc was underweight. They always dropped weight when we were sled training in the winter. He was still heavier than most Alaskan Huskies.

 

I too am most gratified that we're talking about Jade's butt and not yours....hehe. Cute!

[Datagirl79]

My 7 month old puppy Woody has the same butt curl. I call him Fuzzy Wuzzy because his hair is so fluffy. The only curly spot is right over is butt. Its worst when he's just been bathed and its really clean and slightly damp. I need to take a picture of it, incase it ever goes away.

 

What is the "normal" weight for BC's?

[dinah_kay]

And, totally unrelated, but I'm constantly amazed at how small everyone's dogs are! Skittles is the smallest one of my dogs, but compared to most other dogs that people post about here, he's big.

 

 

Well Mary, Charlie is really part horse, lol. Dave is close to Charlie's size, although Charlie is a bit bigger, and he weighs 50lbs. Now Riley is shorter than Dave - more typically sized and she weighs 40lbs.

[stockdogranch]

I like to be able to feel ribs and hip bones, with just a little layer over them, but not so much you can't feel them. If there's more than that, then to me, it's overweight,

 

A

[Genie]

She looks a bit heavy to me. I don't see much tuck up and waistline in those pics. If the ribs are hard to feel, then that's an excellent indicator that she's got a bit more padding than she needs.

Vets are used to seeing pet dogs and will usually consider a slightly overweight dog to be in the normal range.

 

As for the butt fluff, it will probably tame down in time. Zeb had wild cowlicks on his rump at her age, but the hair eventually settled down.

[PSmitty]

Agree with Anna. I keep my dogs thin because it's healthier for them in the long run, Alex participates in sports where lighter means less stress on his body, and Lilly is getting to the age where joint health is an issue, and again lighter is better. Jack takes stockwork lessons, and I think being in condition is important out there, too.

 

Jade *sounds* a bit heavy to me. It's hard to tell from pics because she's so hairy, , but I agree with whoever said there's not much of a waist or tuck-up. And if there is an obvious layer of chub over her ribs, I think she could drop a few.

 

Lilly, my non-BC type dog, is a tick over 20" and weighs 37lbs. Alex is a wee thing, small framed and light boned, so he only weighs 32 lbs at 19" tall.

[JaderBug]

I tend to agree here... I don't think she's terribly overweight, but she could afford to lose a few pounds. She doesn't have a tuck to speak of, and I have to push fairly hard to feel her ribs.

 

So, the question is, how do I take the pounds off her? I cut back on food as of last weekend (from about 1.5 cups a day to 1 cup). She doesn't get many treats at all, one or two a day (the Iams puppy biscuits) and she usually has rawhides available, but I can't imagine they can donate that much weight, can they?

 

Do I get her out and moving more? I guess I'm not sure how much time is considered a proper amount of excercise... a 30 minute game of Frisbee every day? more than that? that plus a walk/run? I would like to start running as well (gee, good thing I picked the end of warm weather to start!)- I could start running/jogging with Jade. One thing I've noticed whenever I run/jog around her is that she tries to cut in front of me, she won't watch where we're going, she tries to get around and look at my face instead. I'd need to get her to knock that off if I were to start jogging with her (suggestions?). Is 10 (almost 11) months old enough to start exercising her, like is she past the puppy stage with worrying about joints?

[silhouettestable]

Jade looks like a cross between two of mine, fluffy-butt Storm and Flurry. Her face is very similar to Flurry. He's the same age as Jade but he's HUGE! I agree with a lot of the other responses, it's hard to say from the pictures because of the hair, but you should be able to tell by what she feels like. Most of mine are on the large side (stucturally - not overly fat) because I wanted larger, strong dogs for sledding. Rain is my only girl and the smallest at about 45 pounds. I'm not exactly sure what Storm weighs, but probably somewhere around 55 pounds. He could likely stand to drop a couple of pounds but that will come as I start putting more miles on them. Flurry, at 10 1/2 months old is a whopping 58 pounds but very tall, long and lean. He's got a wide chest but a nice waist, very obvious tuck and I can easily feel his backbone, ribs and hips. He's got a tremendous amount of bone, very thick legs and big feet. He's taller than all my other dogs (except Noah my rough collie). I haven't measured his height, but he's a bit taller than Lightning who stands 24" and is 65 pounds, and Flurry is still slightly butt high.

 

Here's a question about waists - does anyone know how pulling (sledding/carting) affects the waist of a dog? I find that some of my dogs don't have much of a waist when viewed from above, but looking at their side profile they have a nice tuck and I don't have to dig deep to feel their ribs. I'd say they're anywhere from ideal to only a few pounds overweight at any given time, and yet the waist isn't as clearly defined as some other dogs. I'm thinking that maybe the pulling causes them to muscle up more in that area?

 

On the subject of loosing weight, one day I suddenly noticed my BC/ACD mix was starting to look like a sausage on legs and put him on a diet. I realized what was happening was he had been cleaning up puppy food, or any other leftovers from the other dogs if I wasn't paying close attention, plus I had started using a new food scoop and was giving him more than before without really intending to. I started being very careful to make sure that he now gets only his own food, and for him I went back to the old scoop for feeding and the pounds have started dropping off. It's taken several months but he's now back to looking like he should, instead of a sausage. If Jade is an "easy keeper", you could either feed less or switch to a lower calorie food if you want her to drop some pounds. Exercise is great too, as long as you don't overdo it when she's still growing.

[in2adventure]

Lucia is a solid 45lb. She looks a bit big because of fur, but when she's wet she has a great shape to her. She was 48lb at the start of summer and she very gradually lost the 3 lbs over a month or so. It made a HUGE difference in looks and she seemed to be more active. She will always look burly, I think. Grady on the other hand will be my dainty dog. I got that backwards, huh a dainty male and a burly female The vet tech told me he was way too skinny and I needed to put weight on him. She even gave me the hairy eyeball look you get if your dog is fat He looks just fine to me and nothing sticks out skeletally.

 

I wouldn't run with Jade until she's a year. Maybe extra play running at the park or on trail. Stready running, like jogging, is a bit stressfull on young joints. She does look like she could lose a pound or two, but not much. At 10 months it shouldn't be too hard to get it off. She's still growing too. If you just stabilize her weight, she may grow out of the puppy fat and get leaner without any weightloss.

 

As for the butt fluff, both of mine have it. ost of the time they look like they stuck a paw in a light socket

[Ms.DaisyDuke]

It's really hard to tell with fur like that, but I am going to say, she's a bit chunky. Daisy does look bigger than she is because of her fur, but she is sitting at around 43# and she's about 20" at the shoulders, maybe 22" and I am happy with this weight. She was 47# and the vet told me she was good at that weight and I had a hard time feeling her ribs at that point.

 

Also, Daisy's butt hair is out of control on a good day. I keep it brushed, but 9 times out of 10 she looks homeless!

[Jo&Tex]

Tex is always asking me "Does this fur make me look fat?"

 

He is a plumpster because he just can't run around like a normal dog. He does get a couple of gallops thru the hayfields every day. His weight control is a constant battle.

 

Loki is too thin now from a summer of running around on sheep patrol all day. Petting him is like stroking a washboard. He gets twice food as much as the other two and I add high calories supplements like canned food and homemade soup.

 

Nell was 60+ pounds when she arrived. She looks great now at 45 pounds, but she's losing weigh quickly because of her illness. I've seen a big drop this last month. The pred is kicking in and she's hungry again and I'm spoiling her silly.

 

My vet welcomes me to bring them in anytime for a quick weight check.

[stockdogranch]

A good way to take a bit of weight off them is to reduce their kibble by, say, 1/4 C or 1/2 C. Add in to the kibble they get 1/2 C or 1/4 C (what you took out or more) of canned pumpkin. Not the pumpkin pie mix, just plain old canned pumpkin. They love it, it's good or them, and it keeps them from feeling deprived because they're getting "less food."

 

A

[Pippin's person]

YOu can also throw in some raw oatmeal (and maybe mix the kibble/oatmeal) with some water adn that will also help them feel full (just like it does with people....in theory). Using things like green beans and carrots as treats may also help cut back on the kibble.

[Soda-pop]

huh, I'm reading this and I'm thinking "Soda is too thin!" When I feel her side I can very easily feel her ribs and could easily count them. I can also feel her back bone but she's built like a sight hound.

 

Now I want someone to come and feel my dog and tell me if she's too thin!

[Debbie Meier]

huh, I'm reading this and I'm thinking "Soda is too thin!" When I feel her side I can very easily feel her ribs and could easily count them. I can also feel her back bone but she's built like a sight hound.

 

Now I want someone to come and feel my dog and tell me if she's too thin!

 

The thin and lean dogs can go from just right to too thin real quick. When they get too thin they loose muscle and they feel boney, which is different the just being able to feel their bone structure. When I run my hand over Jake's back I can feel his back bone and his hip bones but the muscles are more predominent, when I run my hand over Dixie's back I can feel the bones more then the muscles, she's in a growth spirt right now and is too lean. One of our other dogs, Bea is on a diet, when she came here you could not feel any bone when you ran your hand over her except the tip of her hip bones. She also looked out of proportion, her head and legs were tiny and thin for her body, as she is trimming up the is also showing more athleticness when she works.

 

Deb

[Genie]

The thin and lean dogs can go from just right to too thin real quick. When they get too thin they loose muscle and they feel boney, which is different the just being able to feel their bone structure. When I run my hand over Jake's back I can feel his back bone and his hip bones but the muscles are more predominent, when I run my hand over Dixie's back I can feel the bones more then the muscles, she's in a growth spirt right now and is too lean.

Deb has a good point. The amount of muscle is a good indicator of proper weight when trying to determine if a dog is too thin.

To help prevent injury, I keep Zeb athletically thin for flyball and frisbee. At one point, he was too thin and not building muscle, even though I had him doing conditioning exercises. I added in a bit more food each day and he has now built some good muscle. Its easiest to feel for muscle on the back legs, so I use that as my guide. His ribs and backbone feel about the same, but he has nice, solid muscle on his rear legs, shoulders, etc.

[Genie]

I would like to start running as well (gee, good thing I picked the end of warm weather to start!)- I could start running/jogging with Jade. One thing I've noticed whenever I run/jog around her is that she tries to cut in front of me, she won't watch where we're going, she tries to get around and look at my face instead. I'd need to get her to knock that off if I were to start jogging with her (suggestions?). Is 10 (almost 11) months old enough to start exercising her, like is she past the puppy stage with worrying about joints?

I wouldn't start running/jogging with her yet, but I would start training her for it. I have a friend who runs with her BC and she had to do a bit of training to get him to understand that he was supposed to run next to her at her pace regardless of any interesting distractions.

Have you taken her to a basic obedience class yet? The heeling exercises are a good foundation for this. In competition obedience, there is a change of pace while heeling that is practiced and that's what you would want to focus on with her. When she understands heel, start adding in short sections of fast and slow while heeling. She should change her pace to match yours. Set out a couple of cones about 8-10 ft apart and heel around them in a figure-8 (at at normal walking pace. The fast/slow work should be done in a straight line). This helps teach her to heel with you when you turn and change pace.

When she's doing well with heeling next to you and changing pace when you do to keep in position, start increasing the fast-jog exercise. If she's distracted at any point, remind her to focus on her job (running next to you). When my friend started jogging with her BC (who loved other dogs and wanted to go see any he met), she used a 'Leave It' command to remind him to ignore the dog and keep jogging with her. I would advise against using that particular command for a couple reasons: 1) that's not what that command is for - it's a don't touch command, not a pay attention to me instead command and 2) the people with the other dog reacted to her as if her dog was aggressive because she gave that command. She started using 'Mind Your Work' instead and found that she didn't get an adverse reaction from other dog owners with that command and her dog quickly learned it.