WyoBC Posted May 25, 2008 Report Share Posted May 25, 2008 Ok, try this one. The timing of the joke kind of went out the window. Sorry for taking your post Dazzle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samantha J Posted May 25, 2008 Report Share Posted May 25, 2008 Ok, try this one. That worked! ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted May 25, 2008 Report Share Posted May 25, 2008 That video was wonderful. I'm working on the "put away your toys" trick now. Ever since Jett, toys all over the floor have been a constant problem. Solo doesn't mess with toys much, and Fly usually mauls one at a time. The problem with having my three is that Solo ends up learning everything -- he's the most tuned in to me and the most fun to play shaping games with (and, well, he's my favorite, so...). He isn't flashy like Dazzle at all -- he's very slow and deliberate, with lots of long, searching looks while he tries to figure out exactly what I want. Teaching him stuff is almost like teaching another person, it's just so cool watching his brain work. So, Solo is the one putting all the toys away, even though it's the pup who makes the mess. I feel the need to train my dogs more. After watching Dazzle's video, I feel like their minds are going to waste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicGirl Posted May 25, 2008 Report Share Posted May 25, 2008 Thank You for sharing! It made me laugh and cry. It reminded my of my dog Bandit who has been gone for a couple of years now. She loved doing tricks. Keep up the good work you to have something special. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abbies_mumma Posted May 26, 2008 Report Share Posted May 26, 2008 I love the suitcase trick. Its so cute when she sticks her nose out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdarling Posted May 26, 2008 Report Share Posted May 26, 2008 Amazing! Great job! I loved her going backwards up the stairs. Many have said you make a great pair, and I couldn't agree more. Being that you've got her opening the front door, the refrigerator door should be easy for her. I put a cool cup around a can of whatever and have Zip "go get me a beer." He hasn't learned how to close the refrigerator yet, though. Jodi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pammyd Posted May 26, 2008 Report Share Posted May 26, 2008 Thankyou for that - I could watch her all day She is so smart and you have worked so hard with her I bet I am not the only one who is going to be doing a bit more work with their dog for the next few weeks Just out of interest how do you target other parts of the body like the back paw in the 'mark' trick?? A nose target was easy and Ben is getting there with front paws although he is not so good at his left or right and sometimes he targets something up high with the wrong paw - then realises and tries to put the other paw up too and falls over I would really love the back paw (have worked all winter when drying his paws to call them by the names I want on each paw) He still squats to pee so I think it would be funny if when people asked me if he is a girl if I could get him to cock his leg) and eventually I think a hip target might be usefull for some backwards tricks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnewe2 Posted May 27, 2008 Report Share Posted May 27, 2008 Wow Kat I'm errr....well....just Dazzled! Great job! Kristen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted May 27, 2008 Report Share Posted May 27, 2008 Very well done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sluj Posted May 27, 2008 Report Share Posted May 27, 2008 Any suggestions you have for more tricks would be greatly appreciated. I am quickly running out of ideas! Terrific video! Have you tried teaching her to nod "yes" and shake her head "no"? Or to count (say, by tapping)? Or maybe put her toys in a certain arrangement (if she has a bunch of critter stuffies, putting them in a circle facing one another for a chat)? Oh, and I'd really love it if you put up some youtube videos demonstrating how you shaped the tricks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurae Posted May 27, 2008 Report Share Posted May 27, 2008 That is just incredible, Kat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo Peep Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 You have a God given talent to training dogs. I was most impressed with the trick you taught Dazzle to "lift her leg". I think you could easily have a career in show biz. I wish you would either PM me or post on here how to teach them how to back up so quickly. Usher is a slug. Are you doing obedience? She has the dumbell down pat and the heeling off leash! Great Great job. Now I have to check out AJ's black jack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kat's Dogs Posted May 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 So, Solo is the one putting all the toys away, even though it's the pup who makes the mess. Dazzle has to clean up after both of the little dogs (and occasionally me), so she can relate with Solo. It is definitely cool to watch the wheels in their heads turning. I love the moments when they just stop, think about it, and then slowly try something and give you a look like "is this it?". Amazing. Just out of interest how do you target other parts of the body like the back paw in the 'mark' trick?? I do it just by shaping with the clicker. Dazzle is good at offering a bunch of behaviors to begin with so I just waited until she bummed her back paw into my hand and went from there. That is how I taught her nose and paw targeting, she actually kind of has a hip target too, which I also taught the same way. Oh, and I'd really love it if you put up some youtube videos demonstrating how you shaped the tricks. Alrighty, we'll work on that. Are you doing obedience? Nope. She isn't registered with the AKC and I never really decided on where else we would compete so I just taught her obedience behaviors for something else to do awhile ago. I guess now that she knows what to do I might as well compete... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 Harrumpph. Here I am stuck behind a firewall and can't watch the video. I don't doubt the star quality of the actors in question though, having met them both. I like to look at the Parti Poodles website for trick training inspiration. Have you tried teaching Dazzle to walk a tightrope yet? Or bake a cake? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kat's Dogs Posted May 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 like to look at the Parti Poodles website for trick training inspiration. Have you tried teaching Dazzle to walk a tightrope yet? Or bake a cake? Oooooo, cool! That is a neat site. Walking a tightrope would be a fun one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaryP Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 Very cool! You and Dazzle are amazing. My favorite was the suitcase trick, too. Charlie knows a few tricks (not nearly as many as Dazzle). I've been trying to teach him the "limp" trick for a while now. I used a click stick initially, but now I can't seem to fade the target stick out. He knows to hold his paw up without needing the stick, but when it comes to the "limp" part, he always is wanting to put his paw on something - my hand or the stick - to do the limping. If I don't have the stick or offer my hand, he'll just put his foot down and hop forward. Any advice on how to teach him to hold his paw up by himself while he limps forward? I can tell that he is really trying to figure out what I want, but I'm obviously not communicating it very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kat's Dogs Posted May 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 Any advice on how to teach him to hold his paw up by himself while he limps forward? What I did with Dazzle was shape her to put her paw in my hand while I was leaning over her back and then from there I held her paw up with my hand while we walked a few steps. I clicked every time she took pressure off my hand and held it up at all on her own. Even if she didn't do it completely by herself, anytime I felt less pressure she got a click. You can probably imagine, at certain points of the walk when her other front paw is on the ground she put less pressure on my hand right from the beginning, so that is where I gave her the click to start with to keep the reinforcement rate high. It didn't take longer for her to offer to hold it up more on her own for the rest of the walk too. Also right from the beginning we were moving forward a step or two so she knew motion was involved - I think that was really helpful in getting her going. I found that she did really need me to actually just hold up her paw the first few reps so she could get the feel of moving on three legs - but after those first few she quickly started not need my hand so much. You can see we still have a ways to go with that one, as she is right by my side with my hand over her while she does it, but I am finding the hand pretty easy to fade. For a while I did still have to hold my hand under her paw, although she never touched it. Then I had to hold my hand right over her back, and then to the point we are at now. So I am definitely still in the picture for her, but we are getting there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diane allen Posted May 29, 2008 Report Share Posted May 29, 2008 A friend just taught her BC a fun trick: She says (with a very exaggerated Texas accent): "What's on yer faaace?" Dog then wipes her face with her paw! (She shaped it by putting peanut butter on the dog's face at first! What a mess!) I too love the suitcase trick...but I don't think my guy will FIT in my suitcase! diane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millie&MeBC Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 What a fabulous video! Dazzle is an awesome dog and you've done an amazing dog at training her. I've been teaching Millie to limp, too. I need to start it back up again. I stopped and taught her to lick her lips when I say, "What do babies taste like?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo Peep Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 I have another question for you Kat. I know you clicker train and I am pretty new to this. Do you still treat when you click? Or have you weaned off treats. Do you click and treat for each new trick, then wean off treats? I taught an old dog the limp, but we didn't have the sticks. I used a leash and said bang- he would limp then I said bang bang and he would play dead- like it took more than one shot to kill him- LOL. I also find I have more patience with obedience or herding than I do with tricks. Any advice on that? Usher still won't shake a paw. He sits there like a nerd waiting for me to tap his foot. Once I give the initial tap, he's fine. I'm still in awe of that video and have shared it with my friends. Dianne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millie&MeBC Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 I showed the vid to my mom, too. She loved it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kat's Dogs Posted May 30, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Do you still treat when you click? Or have you weaned off treats. Do you click and treat for each new trick, then wean off treats? A click is just a marker, it's the promise of a reward that will come later - so at some point or another, it needs to be followed by the reward. Because Daz really does understand that "click = that behavior was good" I can do multiple clicks before giving her the reward and she still understands that (so I don't reward after every click) but I still reward about 90% of them. The click is like a bank's check - it isn't actually money, but you know that it later can be turned into money, so it is valuable to you (and you would probably be happy to work for a company if they gave you checks). But if someone gives you bad checks...well, then they are just slips of paper that are worth nothing and you would probably stop working for them pretty quickly. They promised a reward and never delivered. So the point isn't to ever stop giving the rewards for the clicks...a click isn't a reward, just the promise of one that will come later. Does that answer your question? As far as patience... I don't think of the end product of training tricks as being all that important - it is the process of getting there, the training itself, that is really the whole point. For Daz and I anyway. Trick training, IMO, should just be a game - it should be like playing with your dog and nothing more. Their lives aren't at risk if they don't shake on command (unlike a recall or other obedience and "life-skills" behaviors) so it really doesn't matter if they get it today or not. You can just relax about it and have fun with your dog. I don't have the mindset of "I'm going to teach her to limp today", but rather "I think I'll focus on paw targeting today and see what happens". If we end up with a limp, great! If not, oh well. We can try for that again later. Many times I have some idea in mind, but she offers me something totally different and we just go in that direction instead. That is actually how we ended up with the rolling up in a blanket trick. Like I said, for us it's more just about the time spent training and playing the shaping games - not so much about the end behavior. So don't worry about trying to train something in particular. Relax, smile, make sure it's fun, and if you can, just think of it as play...not as training behaviors. Okay I'm now rambling. Did that make any sense at all? Oh, and if you are interested - this video is in a contest for "Best Trick". You can vote for it once a day here if you like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo Peep Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Yes- it made sense. And you can teach this "old dog" some new tricks. Thanks!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Do you click and treat for each new trick, then wean off treats? It's more like you wean off clicking once the behavior (trick) is established. Clicking is usually only used as a communication method when you are training something new. The reward (a treat, or a pat on the head, or whatever your dog finds rewarding) is the important part, whether or not you click first. The reward is what causes the behavior to increase. As Kat said, the click is just a marker that tells the dog the reward is coming. The reason people use a clicker is that it lets you mark the exact moment the dog does what you want, whereas there will always be at least a little delay before you can physically deliver the reward, regardless of what kind of reward you use. The ability to signal the dog at the exact moment when they're doing the right thing makes it easier for them to understand what the heck the crazy human wants them to do. Once they understand what you want, there's no more need for the clicker, but trick-type behaviors often need to be rewarded at least once in a while to maintain them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pammyd Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Thanks Kat - afraid Ben is to careful with his back feet to put one in my hand. I am a bit new to the clicker so not to good at the free shaping But its something to aim for Love the poodle website I had never heard of the intermediate bridge but it just made so much sense then I ran downstairs and trained it to Ben within 2 sesh he not only had an idea what was going on but with a couple of tricks I was having trouble getting him to hold in position me making the mad noise telling him that he was on the right track worked straight away He now is holding his head in position without my hand there for 'say your prayers' and I can move away from him when he is begging Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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