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7 yo - now having seizures?


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Hi Everyone,

 

Had a call from a friend last night. She has a 7.5 yo BC that all of a sudden is having seizures. He's had 4 now in 18 days - 2 less than 24 hours apart. He's been to UT and they ran the gamut on him - CT, MRI, CBC, Thyroid, TBD. The vets are stumped at this point. The time of day varies as to the seizure, the weather was bad after the 2nd one but not before or after the 1st and just fine when the 3rd and 4th happened. They last about 50 seconds to 2 minutes. One, the 3rd one, she said he acted like a puppy afterwards, no ability to be still and listen, was in constant motion for about 3 hours. The 2nd one he was screaming right afterwards and was dragging his feet somewhat for about 30 minutes.

 

He's never been sick, has not been injured. She's had the water tested, the soil tested, is 99.9% sure he hasn't "eaten" anything strange. Diet hasn't changed, though she is now placing him on raw, no lifestyle change.

 

Both sire and dam owners have been contacted, neither knows of any Epi in the lines (reputable breeders).

 

He's on Potassium Bromide as of yesterday, loading him up but even after the initial load he seized again, though not as bad.

 

Where/what else should she look? I have "zero" knowledge of Epi dogs and just wanted to ask to try to get more input and help her out.

 

I just didn't think a dog his age would all of a sudden start seizing?

 

Thanks!

 

Karen

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At that age I would be looking at disease related seizures. Low blood sugar, low oxygen (cancer pressing on heart or lungs), brain tumor. She ruled out head injury right? I did some research a while back on the causes of epilepsy and I believe it was UofF who's articles said 7 or 8 years of age it was "disease related" typically.

 

The costs can get very high with diagnosis, more than most can pay. If you wait the cause will usually supercede the meds eventually, and then you can make a decision.

 

websites I found very helpful

Diagnostic Work Up for Seizure Dogs

Canine Epilepsy Facts

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Yes, TBD was done during the MRI - they used spinal fluid to check.

 

She's already dumped a boatload of $$ and she will continue, I know her....

 

Head injury has been ruled out. I was thinking disease as well. I will pass along the websites, thanks Lenajo. Cancer was ruled out as well. I know more but am having a hard time digesting it and relaying it here, sorry, he's such a nice dog and I can't believe all of a sudden this is hitting him and her.

 

Karen

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At that age I would be looking at disease related seizures.

 

This was my first thought, too. Having had a seizure dog in rescue for the past 6 months, I've had a bit of an education on seizures. From my understanding, a dog that starts having seizures at a later age is not usually an epi dog, but has some disease [or trauma] that is causing the seizures. Also, I wonder if her vet would consider supplementing the KBr with Phenobarb while she is on the loading dosages. KBr can take several weeks to get to a therapeutic range, but phenobarb starts to work right away. I have to run right now, but those were just a few thoughts that immediately popped into my head.

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Epilepsy is possible but I would be leaning towards other causes like toxin exposure. Is the dog on pheno or just KBr?

 

He's only on KBr. We're checking out other ideas as well, she won't stop until she finds the cause. He's been eating the Eagle Pack Holistic line, she spoke with the manufacturer and nothing has changed in the process or ingredients. All ideas and thought are being looked into and addressed!

 

Thanks for all the input and ideas everyone!

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  • 3 weeks later...

This dog is getting worse. They placed him on Pheno last week. The dose was cut in half by his owner, the dog could not tolerate the drug, can barely stand up on half dosage. Vet said today to cut in half again. He's had 3 more seizures in the past few weeks. U Tenn has no answers and will not help her anymore, they have not even been returning her calls. She may head to Texas or Auburn soon. She was again at the vet today, secondary glaucoma , left eye won't open, due to infection. Many more tests have been done and sent to Dr. Dodd. He had more today, lead test, just to rule it out. Nothing is coming back off though.

 

If posting a pedigree would help I will gladly do that as well. We're grasping at straws now. The dog can't handle the pheno, not sure the dosage, will find out just to know. Nothing is making sense, he's 7 plus...and had 7 plus seizure in the past 40 days. Chest X-Ray was clear, MRI, etc...Acupuncture was done last week, nothing major found then either. None of this is making any sense whatsoever.

 

Any wild ideas? A friend is posting this on VIN as we are just scrambling now.

 

Thanks!

 

Karen

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Could there have been some kind of poisoning? I don't think you should post the pedigree because some may construe that the breeder is at fault when they may not be... Some breeders are really funny about that kind of thing.

 

You may be able to give other information about where the dog was born, working lines, show lines, sport lines etc...

 

I know in goldens there is a line that is susceptible to seizures and they are brought on by chemicals such as lawn stuff, cleaning supplies, etc... and it usually happens by the time the dogs are 3-4 yrs but there is nothing to say that this dog has not been prone to seize and just the right chemical was around...

 

Just some thoughts.

 

I am sorry to hear how sick the dog is...

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Wish you all the luck and hope they get to bottom... I had to put my 3 yr old BC to sleep last year because she was drug resistant to seizures. She was diagnosed with idiopathic Epi -- http://www.bordercolliesociety.com/BC_Info...E/index_ace.htm -check out this link- they are studying EPI in BC and why some dogs are drug resistant. They may have some ideas. Good Luck- prayers with you.

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Tick infection can cause eye issues as well. Anaplasmosis is a big problem in my area and it is know to cause seizures, neck issue, eye issues, fever, lethargy, mlaise, anorexia, muscle pain, meningitis, respiratory issues, diarrhea & so on. If the list looks like it came out of a vet artical it's because it did (Veterinary Medicine April 2008).

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I'd ask the vet to treat for TBD in spite of negative tests. Those things can be sneaky. Three years ago Ben got a TBD that was at the time practically unknown in dogs (though it's a bug that affects horses with some regularity). It's not even vectored by ticks.

 

I'm really sorry for your friend and hope she gets some answers quick. We went through this misery with a 3 year old rescue last year - turned out to be a brain tumor (well, brainstem tumor). :rolleyes:

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Thanks for the thoughts everyone.

 

It's highly unlikely he's been poisoned, no chemicals are used on the lawn and what not, not in the home either. He's with her 7/24 too.

 

She is asking about Doxy, they did a 2 week treatment previously.

 

She's also having all results from UT sent to another center, most likely Texas A&M as she will take him there soon and start over. It's very scary with the glaucoma affecting him now. The pressure has been reduced somewhat with meds started yesterday. She'll be looking into an EEG as well, even if he has to wear a monitor. Basically, from the beginning at another center asap.

 

He's off 2 doses of the Pheno and she has her dog back somewhat, he played tug and ya know, where they are now mentally, she needed that! Will update as info comes available.

 

Thanks!

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I have a dog that started seizuring at the age of 6 1/2 for no apparent reason. I also know of another dog, (Aussie), that didn't start seizuring until 8 yo, although his progeny had started seizing years before he did. :rolleyes: In my dog's case, secondary epilepsy was suspected, but in the Aussie a genetic component was cleary suggested.

 

I found the website, www.canine-epilepsy.com, and the related email group, EPIL-K9, to be a great resourse to me in my struggles with canine epilepsy. I am very glad to say that we achieved a wonderful outcome, with my dog being now 4 1/2 seizure-free and off all medications for 2 1/2 years.

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Just a possible "good" update. This dog is very lucky with who he lives with!! The owner kept pushing and the Optho specialist saw them right away. Yep, something was found, systemic. Now, three vets are working frantically to figure out what is going on. UT was contacted and they admitted to not doing what they said. They never had an eye doctor look at him, they never cultured the SP from the MRI and a few other things.So, they too are back in the picture. We should have results back soon for TBD, Blasto, Fungal and one other that I can't remember right now.

 

The pressure of the glaucoma is gone and his eyes are back to normal (for now), he's on antibiotics and Dr Dodd got back with his Thyroid info, he's "very" low. They're holding off on Thyroxine until the test results come back on the others run last Friday. So, I guess at least we have vets that now see and believe there is something wrong and he's not just developed Epi at 7+

 

And more positive is that we've been 13 days w/o a seizure!!

 

Karen

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  • 5 months later...

After 7 months of h*** we've pretty much gotten a diagnosis and a treatment plan for the boy!!! Though it's not good news, it's answers nonetheless - Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever.

 

With all the TBD tests and titers that were done it took looking at a combo of 3 and a very excellent pathologists and her team to diagnosis it.

 

Now, maybe life can move forward for the owner and he will recover with a new treatment regime. Very atypical in it's expression but RMSF hasn't read the book I guess.

 

Karen

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Karen

So glad they found something to treat.

Mick was diag. with RMSF along with other TBD's. It took almost a year to get the diag. By then he was really bad off. The siezure was the final straw before the diag.

I just wanted to say that he had it so long I was afraid he'd never recover. But over a year later he finally did. He is still not perfect but perfect for us. Please encourage your friend to just take her time and to keep her hopes up. Long recovery but well worth everything we went through.

 

Good luck and sending good vibes from Mick another survivor of RMSF.

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What's sad about this is the lengths that had to be taken to get the dog on the doxycycline, and the damage that had to occur during that time.

 

It's a crying shame when you have to fight with local vets to get your dog some treatment. This could have been so much easier on everyone.

 

Thank goodness for vets like Zink and Dodds.

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Thanks Liz, Kristen and Wendy!

 

Yes, she has fought and fought (a dream owner!) she has also had to fight University of Tennessee and several vets at the clinic where her vet is as well as the opthalmology vet. Her vet is and has been standing behind her and helping, she was however blind to so much due to the lack of info. Still the owner had to fight for her dog. Even though he wasn't "textbook" so many vets were quick to say Epi and write him off......

 

Hopefully the recovery will go fine. At this time there appears to be no noticeable damages per se. She is just thankful the nightmare is apparently over. All the thanks go to her Vet, Chris Zink and Dr. Jean Dodds!

 

Karen

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