Frisbee

[Stuporman]

Hello, everyone,

My just-turned one year old 1/2 Border Collie-1/2 Labrador has really taken well to catching the frisbee, among other things. I've noticed that after about a half hour of catching it and bringing it back, she lies down with the disc defiantly about 15 feet away. If I command her to come she will come without the frisbee. I've tried rapping her sharply on the nose with a rolled-up newspaper and she just becomes more defiant. I know she's not tired out because if I roll another frisbee she'll chase it at full speed. I've become infuriated and hit her 5 times on the snout rapidly and yet she doesn't respond any better; in fact she pays less interest to bringing it back. I don't need a world class frisbee dog, I just want to give her exercise and an outlet for her energy and emotions. She plays with a ball well, but the frisbee has always driven her crazy and I'd like to use that to channel her drive further. If I roll the frisbee quickly after she does this she'll sometimes bring it back. I've smacked her and told her to be a good girl and i hope in time it will work. I will be patient with her. Does anyone have any experience with frisbees and dogs, or better yet any suggestions?

[WyoBC]

I can't believe what I read. Is this for real? Do you think hitting her on the nose is going to make her bring it back better? I don't know one dog that will do something better when they get hit on the nose for it. The first thing you need to do is learning what having a dog means, then figure out that frisbee is supposed to be fun, not a "when am I going to get hit" moment. And, half an hour of frisbee is quite a lot.

 

That's just uncalled for.

 

ETA: That's animal abuse IMO. Whenever you punish your dog for doing something fun, or resting after a half hour of playing, that is abuse.

[billiegirl]

you've got to be kidding! this is no behavior for anyone to experience. how would you like it if after i saw you hit your dog during playtime i came up and whacked you on the nose? that's not fair.....i started to type more, but i have nothing else. i'm just in shock.

[pammyd]

Please leave the rolled up newspaper when you go out to play!!

Poor girl

I would say 1/2 hour is a long time - she is taking a break - even if she runs full pelt after

There are plenty of examples of collies running themselves v ill or even to death because they forget to stop so even if the dog is tired she can still run

So its good she is telling you she had had enough

and if you dont want a world class frisbee dog then this is her play time - which should be fun with no corrections

 

All you need do is pick up the frisbee and stop the game - if she is being defiant (which is rubbish anyway) then she will soon learn that the game only keeps going if she brings the toy back

 

 

again please please find other ways to train your dogs than smacking them - there is lots of good advice here on positive training

Most times your dog does not want to be bad - they want to please you - all you have to do is teach them what the right thing to in the situation

[blackeyesue]

Are you for real? I don't post much but I gotta say..... I play frisbee everyday with my BC Buddy. If you pay attention to the signs, you know when your dog is tired. Stupidman, is it?? your dog is telling you he's tired. Buddy brings the frisbee back and puts it in my hand, walks around to my left side and waits for the throw. When he's tired , he drops it at my feet, walks in front of me about a foot and lays down. Ok, I say, we're done. It's all he need to hear. He picks the frisbee up, happy as can be. He needs a break to cool off, get a drink, whatever. Pay attention to your dog man, and make the game fun. You'll both be the better for it.

[MrLiquid]

Hey girl you wanna go out and play? Yeah that's right my little furball of love come to daddy, awwww, come on come on!!! Oh I know you're excited, yes that's right lets go play frisbee...... YAAAAA!, Oh Oh wait let daddy run back in I forgot to bring out the TORTURE DEVICE FROM HELL HA HA HA HA RAWR!!!!!

 

THAT'S RIGHT GIRL, WHEN YOU FAIL TO BRING YOUR TOY TO ME I'M GOING TO SMACK YOU ON THE NOSE JUST TO LET YOU KNOW HOW MUCH I REALLY LOVE YOU!!!!!!! Now I command you to bring me the frisbee my big furball of joy!

 

 

RAWR!!!!!

[ClickMeBC]

What makes you think that smacking your poor dog on the nose is going to encourage her to return the frisbee? If anything, you discouraging the behavior and greatly decreasing the chances of her enjoying the game in the future. If you want a dog ot play frisbee with in the coming years, I suggest you control your temper, make it FUN for your dog, and contact a trainer that uses 100% positive methods in teaching the retrieve. I would not trust myself if I were you.

 

Put her on a long line if she refuses to come to you. It's clear that you have a recall to work on - I have little doubt, however, that you're making her return unpleasant if she doesn't come the first time. By clipping a 40' line to her collar you have complete control over when she comes or not - when you say the word ONCE and she does not respond, you reel her in gently and praise her when she reaches you. Never, ever hit a dog upon returning to you, even if you've called them a hundred times and they've ignored each "Come!" thoroughly. It's entirely your fault that that dog stays away from you while she's got her frisbee, and quite frankly, I don't blame her one bit.

[Maralynn]

She's tired. Yes, she'll chase it again - she's got high prey drive - in fact she'll probably chase it until she drops from exhaustion if you continue to throw it. High prey drive dog have been known to work or play themselves to death. My 2 y/o BC does exactly the same thing when he gets tired. He normally brings the toy back and dops it on my feet. When he's tired, he takes it and lays down 30 ft away. If I throw it again, he'll chase it again, but that doesn't mean he needs more exercise - in fact, additional exercise would do him far more harm than good at that point.

 

Your dog is telling you she needs a break. IMO, 1/2 hr of excercise is more than enough at a time for a 1 y/o puppy. It could even be too much. Give her (and her joints) time to mature, or you're going to end up with a dog with hip/joint problems by the time she's 5 or 6. Hitting her will just cause her to loose her desire to play with you. Smaking her and telling her to "be a good girl" will confuse her - she's not going to like hearing "good girl" as you teach her it is associated with being smacked.

 

Just curious - if someone treated you the way you've been treating your dog, what wold your repsonse be to them? Would you become more motivated to spend time with them? I sure wouldn't.

 

Put her on a long line if she refuses to come to you. It's clear that you have a recall to work on - I have little doubt, however, that you're making her return unpleasant if she doesn't come the first time.

 

I think the issue is more that she's tired and needs a break. If the OP quit after 20 min of frisbee, instead of playing til she quit, the game would end with her focused on her and eager for more. I doubt that recall would be an issue if she wasn't exhausted and being punished for taking a break.

[juliepoudrier]

Wow, do you really believe that hitting a dog for not returning a frisbee to you is going to somehow improve the chances that she'll return the frisbee to you next time? If you play football with your buddies and get tired and say "enough" and then they smack you around for saying you're tired when they want to continue to play, how long before you decide to just not ever play football with them again? This is not rocket science here. I pity your dog.

 

If frisbee is just supposed to be for fun and exercise for your dog, why do you insist she keep going when she's ready to stop? Back off your poor dog and let her actually enjoy the so-called play for as long as *she* wants to. And maybe you should consider getting help from a professional trainer and getting yourself into an anger management class so that you can learn not to continue to abuse your dog when you're having anger issues.

 

P.S. Chasing a roller, even at full speed, is less hard on your dog's body than having to leap/jump after a flying frisbee. It could be that she's getting sore from the jumping part of catching the frisbee and therefore stopping and yet can still chase a roller because it's not causing the high impact on her body that jumping is (in other words, she's still trying to please you, desptie the abuse, but knows her own limits and so refuses to do the task that *hurts* but will continue to do the task that doesn't hurt or hurts less). If she just turned a year old and you've been playing frisbee with her for a while, then you'll be extremely lucky if you haven't already set in motion joint changes that will cause her plenty of discomfort/pain later on. Congratulations on not putting your dog's health and wellbeing first and then punishing her when she's said "enough."

 

Oh, and maybe you should do some reading on dog behavior. Projecting emotions like defiance on a dog is anthropomorphising her. She isn't being defiant, she's trying to communicate with you in the only way she knows how. And getting punished for it.

 

J.

[kelpiegirl]

Every fiber of my being says that this is a troll. Do not be sucked in.

 

Hello, everyone,

My just-turned one year old 1/2 Border Collie-1/2 Labrador has really taken well to catching the frisbee, among other things. I've noticed that after about a half hour of catching it and bringing it back, she lies down with the disc defiantly about 15 feet away. If I command her to come she will come without the frisbee. I've tried rapping her sharply on the nose with a rolled-up newspaper and she just becomes more defiant. I know she's not tired out because if I roll another frisbee she'll chase it at full speed. I've become infuriated and hit her 5 times on the snout rapidly and yet she doesn't respond any better; in fact she pays less interest to bringing it back. I don't need a world class frisbee dog, I just want to give her exercise and an outlet for her energy and emotions. She plays with a ball well, but the frisbee has always driven her crazy and I'd like to use that to channel her drive further. If I roll the frisbee quickly after she does this she'll sometimes bring it back. I've smacked her and told her to be a good girl and i hope in time it will work. I will be patient with her. Does anyone have any experience with frisbees and dogs, or better yet any suggestions?

[Little Bo Boop]

Every fiber of my being says that this is a troll. Do not be sucked in.

 

 

Yep Roger that.

[MaryP]

Yep Roger that.

 

I agree.

[Pat W.]

OP only living up to handle....STUPOR man....sheesh Danger Troll crossing

[BustopherJones]

Stuporman, I hope your post was in jest. But if it was not, I really can't add much to what has already been said, except:

NEVER, NEVER, NEVER hit a dog!

The only acceptable excuse for hitting a dog is to stop an attack or break up a fight. All dogs, and especially Border Collies, must be handled with praise and reward if being trained. Raising a dog is not unlike raising a child (hopefully, you do not use the same approach with kids). When your BC does what you want it to do, then you should lavish praise and affection, and have some type of treat handy; the dog will associate good behavior with pleasant aftermath. Unacceptable behavior, on the other hand, can usually be dealt with through use of a sharp word or tone of voice, or (in extreme circumstances) the use of a water pistol; but the circumstances you describe do not warrant this. Your current path will only break the dog's spirit and cause it to fear you, with other consequent behavioral problems at a later date.

[Dixie_Girl]

I'm not sure about the troll thing. He's been a member almost 2yrs and this is only his 7th post. Perhaps he just doesn't know better.

 

There is a lot of good advice here, please take the advice and do your dog and yourself a favor. You will have a much easier time with new stuff. I saw on your other post you advocate the same treatment. Some people believe that beating a dog, and that's what whacking with a newspaper is, will make the dog submisive. Well, it certainly scares the hell out of them. But they also will never have confidence in themselves. Or anything they may try to learn. We all make mistakes. That makes us ignorant. Then we get schooled on the right way. And we admit we may have done it wrong and we change. We grow as individules. That makes us smart. Or we don't, and become stupid.

[shatchp]

Stuporman

 

Don't stop reading these replies, even if your pride takes a hit. Listen. Very few people get a dog and decide to be abusive (although some do) ... but many have been raised or taught incorrectly to punish dogs, often by hitting. This is both wrong and really ineffective. Having this type of relationship with a dog is stressful for you and the dog.

 

Please accept that you may not be working at this the best way, and accept some criticism. To be straight: the dog doesn't need to change, you do. You've already been told why and how. And hitting makes everything worse...it causes your dog emotional damage to be hit by the love of her life. Imagine what that might feel like for her...

 

You undoubtedly love your dog, so for her, put on some humility and make some changes...you might even post again for advice as you work on it.

[sweet_ceana]

I won't even say please- Don't hit your dog. The dog will not learn to do anything from being hit. It will just associate pain & fear with frisbee-- and you!

[hoku's mum]

I hope you are still reading this, if you are really asking for help. Please dont let your pride stop you from getting the very heart-felt messages that are in many of these replies.

 

I really think your pup is tired after 1/2 hour of solid Frisbee. Try mixing your play up, and stop BEFORE your pup is tired and asking for a break the only way she know how. Set her up to succeed. Give her a rest, and play something different (do tricks, find-it games, get a basketball and play soccer with her, lots of fun ways to get exersize and strengthen your bond) Great training can be done while playing, with the toss of the Frisbee or a ball as the reward. Keep it fun, getting smacked in the nose is no fun, and I worry that your dog could develop some really hard problems from such treatment. BC's are very sensitive, it does not take much to switch on the fear button, and that coupled with lack of confidence (which is what you are doing, eroding her confidence) can be a nasty combo possibly leading into fear aggression. So please, take our words seriously, and educate yourself about positive training methods, you will not be sorry, I promise.