Need Positive Thoughts/Prayers for Ben

[iluvlucy]

hope ben starts feeling better soon

 

and yes BARB humans do contract rocky mt tick fever. one of my cousiins almost died from it.

[Pippin's person]

Hope he's feeling better this morning--though from your late posts, I'll bet you're pretty beat.

[Zoe]

http://www.bordercollie.org/boards/index.php?showtopic=13026

 

Rebecca, I hope Ben is feeling better soon. I don't know if you read the above thread but thought I'd try and link it. Hope it works. We are having horrible trouble with ticks this year. I have found multiple attached ticks on Dylan and they have been horribly stubborn about being removed. Thankfully we don't have the diseases that you do your side of the water ( Lyme is not unheard of, but according to my vet is rare and not a concern where we are ). If I were somewhere else though, I would consider the product mentioned in the thread above. I am planning to ask my vet if it is available through him anyway.

 

best wishes

[Jack & Co.]

Hope Ben is feeling better this morning, Rebecca. Is your trip still on?

[Beach BCs]

Sure hope Ben gets to feeling better soon. Sending happy healing thoughts your way.

[Rebecca, Irena Farm]

Still planning on the clinic!

 

Ben's a smidge bettter. Will update more later - I have to run and get this rescue dog (Ben's coming along for the ride so he can enjoy the cranked down air in my car!).

 

He had a spike around two (I think, it's kind of blurry) and so I was scared to sleep all night! I got a couple hours rest between 5 and 7 but I'm looking forward to when Patrick gets back from his trip tonight and I can crash.

 

No worries - it's better when I can DO something. I've been giving Ben little meals of potato and beef slurry (with some sheep energy drench mixed in) every couple hours so the meds don't eat his stomach.

 

And he can walk much better on his own. That's a relief!

 

Thanks everybody for thoughts and prayers - I'll be back later with the new dog and more info on Ben's progress.

[Lenajo]

Be sure that you and your human family get tested too...that is if you see anything "off". It can be pretty nasty in human too.

[DixiesDad]

Lady remebers all the good advice and vibes that came from Irena Farm to help her

She wants Ben to know she's really pulling for him and is sending those good vibes back

[TaliC2007]

When Ben's not grumpy and sick he can finish a faceoff in mere seconds. That's what most dogs can sense before it gets to that point even, I guess.

 

I am sure it is posted on this board somewhere, but I don't have time to go searching. How big is Ben?

If he is the dog in your sig, he is beautiful. Hope he is feeling better.

[Black Watch Debatable]

All good thoughts headed Ben's way from SoCal ---

 

L

[sweet_ceana]

Feel better Ben!

[Samantha J]

Just letting you know that good wishes are coming form me in the UK too for Ben. He has a great mum.

[Rebecca, Irena Farm]

Ben's just a bit better this morning. He's sleeping in a more normal position instead of Road Pizza position. He must be wiped out, as he's still just mostly sleeping. His balance is MUCH better, too - that's a relief to see.

 

I have one small worry - he's starting to feel the stomach-upsetting effects of the doxycycline - he barfed twice yesterday. And he still refuses to eat, so that's really bad in terms of his needing something fairly substantial down there to buffer the doxy. I'm making him walk around after the doxy dose to make sure it doesn't sit in one place in his tummy, and I'm still force feeding him my potato paste mixture every few hours, which is probably better than nothing. But he'd be a lot more comfortable if he would eat something sustantial.

 

Thanks for your thoughts and prayers and keep it up, please! I believe it's making a huge difference to us. His progress has been slow but amazingly uneventful, all things considered.

[Samantha J]

I have one small worry - he's starting to feel the stomach-upsetting effects of the doxycycline - he barfed twice yesterday. And he still refuses to eat, so that's really bad in terms of his needing something fairly substantial down there to buffer the doxy. I'm making him walk around after the doxy dose to make sure it doesn't sit in one place in his tummy, and I'm still force feeding him my potato paste mixture every few hours, which is probably better than nothing. But he'd be a lot more comfortable if he would eat something sustantial.

 

 

I am not familiar with the Doxy but i know in humans that some antibiotics can make you feel very ill. I wonder if there is anything the vet can give to a dog like an anti emetic? Maybe nausea makes him not want to eat and if they can give something to help that he may be a little more hungry. JMO. Glad he is generally more comfortable though, we love em so much and worry about them.

[kelpiegirl]

Awww honey. I wonder if the timing of when he gets the meds means anything? I know when I take medication, if I take it at night- HEARTBURN, and on an empty stomach- not good. Hmmm, maybe make a slurry of some meaty stuff, so that it is easy to eat, and not bulky... I know they say milk helps coat the stomach. It is really good you are home with hiim to give him tlc. I feel really bad for him

Hey, do you have any pics of this boy?

Julie

 

Ben's just a bit better this morning. He's sleeping in a more normal position instead of Road Pizza position. He must be wiped out, as he's still just mostly sleeping. His balance is MUCH better, too - that's a relief to see.

 

I have one small worry - he's starting to feel the stomach-upsetting effects of the doxycycline - he barfed twice yesterday. And he still refuses to eat, so that's really bad in terms of his needing something fairly substantial down there to buffer the doxy. I'm making him walk around after the doxy dose to make sure it doesn't sit in one place in his tummy, and I'm still force feeding him my potato paste mixture every few hours, which is probably better than nothing. But he'd be a lot more comfortable if he would eat something sustantial.

 

Thanks for your thoughts and prayers and keep it up, please! I believe it's making a huge difference to us. His progress has been slow but amazingly uneventful, all things considered.

[bc friend]

I have one small worry - he's starting to feel the stomach-upsetting effects of the doxycycline - he barfed twice yesterday. And he still refuses to eat, so that's really bad in terms of his needing something fairly substantial down there to buffer the doxy.

 

 

Sara's surgeon prescribed 10 mg Pepcid AC (over the counter) twice daily to prevent nausea/vomiting from the antibiotics she is on from her liver lobectomy. Maybe the Pepcid would help Ben's tummy as well.

[2 Devils]

I agree try some pepcid or even the generic. I have known many dogs that take pepcid. It is safe for them.

[shanni and kingsley]

poor ben...

 

hope he gets better soon!!!

[shanni and kingsley]

double post

[juliepoudrier]

Becca,

I checked the Tick Links page, and here is a section from Gil. Ash, who is very active on Tick-L, regarding doxycyclione treatment and how to make it less stressful for your dog:Doxycycline treatment.

 

I'll quote a good part of the information here:

According to the University of Georgia, the common dosage of doxy for Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever (RMSF) can be as high as 20 mg/kg by body weight given twice a day. That may be because this is a fast-acting disease that a dog without treatment will either recover from or die from, but the slower acting ehrlichiae are just as capable of killing and half that 20 mg/kg amount of doxy as an aggressive dose to combat them decisively, which is the key word here, is surely warranted when so many dogs may suffer all their lives from the effects of ehrlichiosis even if they don't succumb to it.

 

Caution: Do not give out-of-date doxycycline! Tetracycline drugs can cause kidney damage if given after their expiration dates.

 

When giving doxycycline, be sure to give it with food, just before a meal or with it. Unlike other tetracyclines, doxy is not greatly affected by the calcium in dairy products; so, while you should err on the safe side and not feed a lot of them, it's not necessary to worry about poking a tablet in a small amount of cheese or slipping a capsule in a spoonful of yogurt if that will help get it down your dog.

 

Tablets appear to be easier on the dog. Capsules may stick in the esophagus and cause irritation if they dissolve and release the doxy there instead of in the stomach so, if you use capsules, butter them or coat them in grease to make them go down easily.

 

Opening capsules or breaking tablets may also irritate the esophagus.

 

If your dog is nauseated by being given the dose for a 12 hour period all at once, you can divide the dose and give half that amount twice in 12 hours, 4 half doses in 24 hours; as long as he gets all he needs in a day, that's all that counts. Always, however, give it with food.

 

Tetracyclines, including doxycycline, can sometimes cause yellowing of the teeth that are still being formed in the gums. The teeth of pups six months or older shouldn't be affected. Amoxicillin at 20 mg/kg PO (by mouth) for eight weeks can be used instead for Lyme disease but it is useless in the treatment of ehrlichiosis.

 

Since doxy is the most effective of the drugs you can use to fight ehrlichiosis, most forms of which are very dangerous, you have to ask yourself, in the case of a very young pup, if you really care that much about yellowed teeth.

 

Doxycycline is an antibiotic. All antibiotics destroy or inhibit bacteria and don't differentiate "good" from "bad"; they wipe out beneficial bacteria in the dog's gut right along with the disease-causing organisms. It's a wise idea, then, to give the dog probiotics as long as he's taking doxycycline and for several weeks afterward to avoid the gastrointestinal problems that can develop if he's left without this help for eight weeks or more.

 

Probiotics such as lactobacillus acidophilus are available in capsules in health food stores. Plain yogurt with active cultures is also useful but probably not as effective. Stoneyfield is one of the most recommended brands of yogurt. Be sure there is no flavoring or sugar in the kind you buy.

 

Important! Give probiotics two hours "after" doxycycline.

 

Because doxy will wipe out the beneficial bacteria you've given your dog in the form of probiotics, you have to keep giving them after every dose. If you give probiotics before the doxy has cleared the dog's digestive system, you may as well not bother. So stick to the two hour delay and keep it up after every dose of the antibiotic until a few weeks after your dog's treatment is over.

 

One last note on doxycycline. It is processed mainly through the liver and a dog with a damaged liver may not be able to take it. Amoxicillin, on the other hand, leaves through the kidneys and is an acceptable alternative to doxy as a treatment for Lyme as long as the dog doesn't have renal disease. (Amoxicillin is not effective against ehrlichiosis.) More than likely, your vet will have done a CBC and serum chemistry before putting your dog on any treatment for TBD and will have identified any problem areas to take into account, so this is just a heads up.

 

If the dog still has problems with nausea, you can ask your vet about giving him Reglan (metaclopromide).

 

I hope some of that information helps you in dealing with Ben's intolerance to the doxycycline. It may be worth your while to join Tick-L (info on how to do so is also provided at the first link above) and get additional advice on helping Ben tolerate the doxy.

 

For anyone else reading, the tick links page is an excellent resource for all things relating to tick-borne diseases. It is well worth bookmarking.

 

J.

[Lenajo]

Rebecca when Lena was at her worst I would cook her white fish (deboned) with cooked sweet potatos and scrambled eggs. The good old Dodd's recipe. She would eat that at her worst and loved every bite.

 

I also used Seacure, white fish flour basically, as a protein supplement to help her gain her weight back after the first episode - remember she had lost from 38 lbs to 29? She liked that too.

 

I

[BustopherJones]

Lenajo, one thing I have noticed about the Merrick canned foods is that almost all of them contain some variant of apples. Missy absolutely loves the Merrick foods (she'd better, given what it costs per can; I can feed a child for less money). Do you think that adding apples to your mix is a good idea?

[Rebecca, Irena Farm]

Thanks for reminding me about Merrick - Patrick's going to the holistic pet store for me on the way home from work tonight (what a trooper, huh?) to pick up some tripe and canned food - but I couldn't remember what kind to tell him to get him. Ben's favorite is Working Dog Stew. I'll get him to get Ben a case of that.

 

I was planning to RE-join tick-L the next time I had more than five minutes to spare at the computer. I was on it for years, years ago.

 

According to the University of Georgia, the common dosage of doxy for Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever (RMSF) can be as high as 20 mg/kg by body weight given twice a day.

 

Check.

 

Caution: Do not give out-of-date doxycycline! Tetracycline drugs can cause kidney damage if given after their expiration dates.

 

Check. Got mine at the pharmacy. $40, wow. Oh, well, the fact that the vet bill was less than the doxy was a real blessing.

 

When giving doxycycline, be sure to give it with food, just before a meal or with it.

 

Check. Kind of. I'm force feeding potato gruel since he is completely uninterested in eating. Probably this has kept things even better than they could be. I can remember much worse problems in the past. That's why I started the force feeding before we even went to the vet - I suspected he'd be started on doxy right away.

 

Unlike other tetracyclines, doxy is not greatly affected by the calcium in dairy products;

 

Ben's allergic to dairy. And eggs. And chicken. And all grains. And tomato, though it doesn't matter in this context.

 

Ben is so extremely wise to the pill thing that it took the VET five minutes to get the pills down him at the office. He finally showed me a trick - his last ditch technique for pill fighters (he said Ben's the most clever he's ever seen). He stuck the pill in then syringed a bunch of water into the back of his mouth, then clapped Ben's mouth shut. GULP! That's been a real life saver. If Ben starts eating again, though, he'll eat almost anything in tripe.

 

Tablets appear to be easier on the dog.

 

Check. I had to do the butter thing with capsules once, that was nasty.

 

If your dog is nauseated by being given the dose for a 12 hour period all at once, you can divide the dose and give half that amount twice in 12 hours, 4 half doses in 24 hours;

 

Hmm. I might try that. The third day is always the worst and that might prevent the severe reaction.

 

It's a wise idea, then, to give the dog probiotics as long as he's taking doxycycline and for several weeks afterward to avoid the gastrointestinal problems that can develop if he's left without this help for eight weeks or more.

 

Double check. I'm using the refrigerated gel form - I personally think that's most viable and effective.

 

Important! Give probiotics two hours "after" doxycycline.

 

Hmm. Oops. I don't think that's been a problem every time but I've not been paying attention.

 

If the dog still has problems with nausea, you can ask your vet about giving him Reglan (metaclopromide).

 

We're not there yet but I did know this was an option. I'm slightly nervous because he's had a bad reaction to ace before and I think that's one of the drugs implicated in the mdr1 thing. So we'll make that an option for if we get really desperate.

[bcnewe2]

Oh Rebecca my worst nightmares.....

It's such a touch and go thing. Keep hangin on. I think the only thing that kept Mick going was his will to eat. he still does and he takes pills wonderfully.

when Ben's back to eating a bit you might try our old routine,

A few bites of dinner (or breakfast, lunch, snacks and so on) then the pill wrapped up in his favorit treat of the day. If it's tripe, can't you just rap the pill in the tripe? We didn't get to do anything else till the pill was in. It got so bad that after the long doxy haul he would look up during meals waiting for the pill. We did the gelled probiotic thing too. Hey, Bute helped after he started walking again. Which amazes me as you'd think it would have tore his stomach up along with the Doxy. But it did help him feel better.

 

It's funny that you and Julie were describing Ben and Solo like that. It's Mick to a T! Even the 2 LGD's (even when they were intact) won't mess with the door troll Mick. He finally learned he can't win all battles or at least he lost one and has backed off a tad. The only thing that I'll give him is he usually doesn't go looking for trouble but damn the dog that looks at him sideways! I attribute his asswholyness to growing up with the 2 TBD's made him feel like he either had to kill any dog that came up to him or he was going to die and/or the fact he lives in a household of 5 goddesses! They're all his!

 

I know Mick has some brain fry residuals but he's so happy that he's not even the same dog. It's hard to remember what he was really like back then. Living was my only hope, now we actually work sheep! I'm so sorry Ben has all the other issues to boot.

 

Just when one nightmare seems to calm down you have another one. It's not Ben your best year.

Here's praying that things will soon lighten up on all of your house.

Sending all the healing energy we have!

xoxo

Kristen

[rosefarm]

My thoughts and good wishes for Ben, hope he perks up quickly

--Denise