Rskillz Posted June 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 I am looking at the BCR site and I see PLENTY of puppies http://bcrescue.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t...b046a91a1eb9756 http://bcrescue.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t...b046a91a1eb9756 http://bcrescue.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t...b046a91a1eb9756 http://bcrescue.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t...b046a91a1eb9756 just a few Ya I'm checking out that site now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStacks Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 It is highly unlikely that you will find a puppy from a breeder in that time frame. A GOOD breeder does not have litters on hand and their pups are spoken for often before conception of the litter. I would almost bet that any "breeder" you locate with a pup available now is not someone I would want to deal with. Try these pups: http://bcrescue.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=15999 The reason most rescues are older are because when the cuteness wears off and the dog is deemed a nuisance rather than cute little puppy they are dumped. This is why you are being cautioned to spend some time with the breed first. A BC puppy turns into a BC teenager and it can be a lot to handle. Also, the adorable pup you posted a picture of reminds me of how my pup was posed for pictures. Something about it creeps me out and sends up red flags. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 FYI, from the link Lauren posted (Houdini & Moose), one of them is going home in a few days, just don't know which yet. Per Debbie. She does seem to end up with puppies pretty frequently (though she claims to hate them ), she'd be a good one to contact, in case she gets more. I LOVE this guy in Knoxville, TN. http://search.petfinder.com/petnote/displa...i?petid=8296005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 One thing I'd be worried about with getting a older BC or rescue dog is how it would fit in with the two dogs already at my home, the italian greyhound and black lab. Are BCs social dogs? Do they mix in with other adult dogs well? I figured a puppy would grow used to the other dogs by being around them from such a young age. A puppy might, or might not. The other dogs might not appreciate having a puppy around. Puppies are very annoying to some older dogs. In dog language, they are rude. Depending on how patient the existing dogs are (especially the Italian Greyhound, who is small and fragile), a puppy may or may not work out well. An older dog in rescue will often have been evaluated with other dogs, and a good rescue will even have some idea of what type of dog the Border Collie mixes best with. I'd be a bit worried with the Italian Greyhound in the house, just because they are so tiny and made of balsa wood and string. Then again, if the Lab hasn't squashed it yet, it must be pretty good at self-preservation. In general, Border Collies are not "social' in the sense that they are really into playing with other dogs. They tend to like playing with other Border Collies (because they will have similar play styles) and might be picky about their friends. My two enjoy the company of dogs they already know well, one of them is OK with stranger dogs that she meets, and the other one wants nothing to do with random stranger dogs. Border Collies are much more into doing something with a human than with another dog, and a common sight at your average dog park is the one Border Collie running around and staring at every person who has a ball in his or her hand, meanwhile totally ignoring the other dogs, who are all playing with each other. When Border Collies ARE interested in other dogs, they tend to want to chase them more than play with them, and sometimes other dogs (especially if they are not used to being stared at, stalked, and chased) really REALLY don't appreciate this. The folks on the Boards are already used to a common theme in my photos. My photos are almost all of Solo (because he can strike a pose like nobody's business). Fly is almost always in the background, hunkered down, waiting. That's because Fly is obsessed with chasing Solo and she is waiting for him to start moving so she can start chasing. Luckily, Solo doesn't care if Fly chases him, but when she does this to other dogs, they often become annoyed and/or aggressive, which is why I don't let her do it in the park to strange dogs. The blob over Solo's right shoulder is Fly. Fly in the background waiting... Still waiting... And here's an edited, indoor version of what Fly likes to do (video link): she likes to watch Many of the dogs in rescue are adolescents or young adults. This is because they are no longer cute puppies and whoever bought them as puppies could not handle the reality of a full-sized Border Collie. However, Border Collies mature late mentally, so if you adopted a dog between the ages of say, seven months and two years there is still a TON of learning, growing, and personality-forming happening. Males in particular mature late, and my male did not really start acting like an adult dog until he was over four years of age. In other words, for you an adolescent may be the best of all worlds -- old enough for real training and interaction and activity, but still mentally malleable. Not to mention that if you are in the market for, say, a young male dog around a year of age, plus or minus a few months, you will face a true embarrassment of riches in rescue because these are the dogs that are usually given up -- not because there is anything wrong with them -- but because they are teenage male Border Collies who belonged to people that never should have gotten a Border Collie in the first place. Don't count out rescue because you don't see a lot of puppies now. Like I said, I am willing to bet that if you spent some time around young adult dogs available for adoption you would easily be able to see yourself taking any number of them home with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaryP Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 Nevermind. I see Lauren already posted them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoloRiver Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 Also, the adorable pup you posted a picture of reminds me of how my pup was posed for pictures. Something about it creeps me out and sends up red flags. If you follow the picture link you get to the breeder's page and personally, this is not a breeder I would buy from. There is little to no information about the dogs on the website, but it does detail payment options and that they will ship anywhere. Can you say, "red flag?" To the original poster -- PLEASE, if you MUST buy a puppy let us help you find a good breeder. There are far too many irresponsible Border Collie breeders out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rskillz Posted June 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 If you follow the picture link you get to the breeder's page and personally, this is not a breeder I would buy from. There is little to no information about the dogs on the website, but it does detail payment options and that they will ship anywhere. Can you say, "red flag?" To the original poster -- PLEASE, if you MUST buy a puppy let us help you find a good breeder. There are far too many irresponsible Border Collie breeders out there. I noticed all of that, and sent a email with concerns. (took it down) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carson Crazies Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 Once again, I'm having trouble finding a good breeder in the southeast. Just as I'm having issues finding rescue sites with puppies. Maybe I'm just on the outside looking in, but anyway someone could point me in the right direction? I would go to http://www.usbcha.com/upcomingtrials.htm and find a trial in an area where you'll be. I'd then go to the trial, and watch the dogs - and get to know their handlers (just not right before they run). Watch and learn which dogs you like and why, and ask questions. You'll learn which dogs you like and why, and where to get one. Most good breeders don't just have puppies lying around that they can send you - it may take some time... it's a very word of mouth type of thing. I waited a year or so for my pup, and it was SO worth it. Any puppy worth having, IMO, is worth waiting for. Editing to add: You want to find a puppy that is produced from livestock working parents. You would expect this puppy to be ABCA registered (as a general rule) and NOT AKC registered. There may be some folks here willing to suggest via PM some breeders??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aljones Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 Also, the adorable pup you posted a picture of reminds me of how my pup was posed for pictures. Something about it creeps me out and sends up red flags. In a weird way, I'm glad I'm not the only one who had that reaction to the photo (almost simultaneously with my "awwwww, pupppyyy!" reaction, in fact). I even immediately checked out the website of the "breeder" in question to see if the pic was posted there (it wasn't). Sorry for the hijack. Having lived with BCs for 30+ years and having acquired them in all fashions, I really encourage you to keep in touch with rescue organizations, for all the reasons folks have already given. And I found a young adult (18-month-old) dog easiest for me to manage as a student. When I later obtained a 6-month-old pup, in fact, I realized just how lucky I was to begin with an older dog, especially when I needed to study for more than 2.5 minutes at a stretch. Best of luck in your search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Oop Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 I have to say, I have been very impressed by the thoughtful and well thought out responses to the OP. A couple of years ago, when we first got Allie, I most definitely could have used this great advice. It would not have changed my mind about getting a Border Collie because I was very sure I wanted one, but all of the research and reading in the world doesn't take the place of experience (even somebody else's). Rskillz, I am also an advocate of the "rescue" dog (both of my own dogs are from rescue - the first one we got at 5 mos. old and the second, at age 2) and wouldn't get a dog any other way. I definitely understand the appeal of a puppy -- we got Allie at 5 mos. old because we wanted our young son to have the experience of raising a puppy. I would probably do it again, but be forewarned -- it may be the longest 15 - 18 mos. of your life Allie was relinquished to rescue at a mere 12 weeks of age by a young woman who decided she wanted a BC puppy and so she purchased Allie from a "breeder." Well, to make a long story short -- this pup was more than she had bargained for and at least she made efforts to find a rescue to take the pup. Allie was transported by kind and loving volunteers from Ft. Collins, CO to Casper, WY to the only rescue that had room. We adopted her shortly after. She was never mistreated, abused or starved -- in fact, just the opposite, she was a very pampered little pup. She is wonderful, friendly and is so athletic and graceful! She is also headstrong, fearful of loud noises and has an OCD with water. I love her. Rusty, my other dog, we adopted recently at 2 yrs. of age. He didn't have Allie's early intervention and has been through quite a few homes. The rescue that we adopted him from did a terrific job with him and even though he gets a little anxious and always wants us to be in sight, he is really a terrific dog and very sweet. He isn't as fast or agile as Allie, but is still very athletic. He is also a quick learner and has adapted very well. He is a sweetheart. I wish you luck in your search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rskillz Posted June 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 A puppy might, or might not. The other dogs might not appreciate having a puppy around. Puppies are very annoying to some older dogs. In dog language, they are rude. Depending on how patient the existing dogs are (especially the Italian Greyhound, who is small and fragile), a puppy may or may not work out well. An older dog in rescue will often have been evaluated with other dogs, and a good rescue will even have some idea of what type of dog the Border Collie mixes best with. I'd be a bit worried with the Italian Greyhound in the house, just because they are so tiny and made of balsa wood and string. Then again, if the Lab hasn't squashed it yet, it must be pretty good at self-preservation. In general, Border Collies are not "social' in the sense that they are really into playing with other dogs. They tend to like playing with other Border Collies (because they will have similar play styles) and might be picky about their friends. My two enjoy the company of dogs they already know well, one of them is OK with stranger dogs that she meets, and the other one wants nothing to do with random stranger dogs. Border Collies are much more into doing something with a human than with another dog, and a common sight at your average dog park is the one Border Collie running around and staring at every person who has a ball in his or her hand, meanwhile totally ignoring the other dogs, who are all playing with each other. When Border Collies ARE interested in other dogs, they tend to want to chase them more than play with them, and sometimes other dogs (especially if they are not used to being stared at, stalked, and chased) really REALLY don't appreciate this. The folks on the Boards are already used to a common theme in my photos. My photos are almost all of Solo (because he can strike a pose like nobody's business). Fly is almost always in the background, hunkered down, waiting. That's because Fly is obsessed with chasing Solo and she is waiting for him to start moving so she can start chasing. Luckily, Solo doesn't care if Fly chases him, but when she does this to other dogs, they often become annoyed and/or aggressive, which is why I don't let her do it in the park to strange dogs. The blob over Solo's right shoulder is Fly. Fly in the background waiting... Still waiting... And here's an edited, indoor version of what Fly likes to do (video link): she likes to watch Many of the dogs in rescue are adolescents or young adults. This is because they are no longer cute puppies and whoever bought them as puppies could not handle the reality of a full-sized Border Collie. However, Border Collies mature late mentally, so if you adopted a dog between the ages of say, seven months and two years there is still a TON of learning, growing, and personality-forming happening. Males in particular mature late, and my male did not really start acting like an adult dog until he was over four years of age. In other words, for you an adolescent may be the best of all worlds -- old enough for real training and interaction and activity, but still mentally malleable. Not to mention that if you are in the market for, say, a young male dog around a year of age, plus or minus a few months, you will face a true embarrassment of riches in rescue because these are the dogs that are usually given up -- not because there is anything wrong with them -- but because they are teenage male Border Collies who belonged to people that never should have gotten a Border Collie in the first place. Don't count out rescue because you don't see a lot of puppies now. Like I said, I am willing to bet that if you spent some time around young adult dogs available for adoption you would easily be able to see yourself taking any number of them home with you. Once again, great post. I love the way you write and take pictures. The video made me chuckle. Fly is gorgeous, that's the color scheme I'd love to have if I could find it. So long as it isn't hostile with the other dogs, I'm fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaryP Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 . . . we do ask that you pay for a 5# bag of Purina Puppy chow. At least they feed only the best food to their puppies. [insert sarcasm] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
painted_ponies Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 I don't want to comment on the inofrmation in the email you posted - because I don't think it's polite to post a private communication without asking the other person's permission first. I will say you should not consider anyone who advertises puppies on the internet. It's fine if their farm has a website. But a good breeder will not have puppies ready and waiting to go to anyone who happens by on the net. And I will say that nothing I read in the email changes my opinion of breeders who advertise pups in this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rskillz Posted June 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 I don't want to comment on the inofrmation in the email you posted - because I don't think it's polite to post a private communication without asking the other person's permission first. I will say you should not consider anyone who advertises puppies on the internet. It's fine if their farm has a website. But a good breeder will not have puppies ready and waiting to go to anyone who happens by on the net. And I will say that nothing I read in the email changes my opinion of breeders who advertise pups in this way. I agree it isn't the most polite thing to do, so I've taken it down. I just thought your expertise could help me into deciding if it would be a breeder worth buying from. Like i said, this is all new to me and I'm a complete noob to all of this, which is why I'm leaning on this site for advice and guidance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 If you're looking at breeders, I'm sorry, I have nobody to recommend. Lots of folks here won't talk breeders specifically, maybe someone can PM you. But I will say, if you get caught up in looking at breeders online, don't get sucked in with pretty pictures. You're going to want as much info as possible on the dam and sire of the pups. Ideally, they'd be working dogs or trialing. There should be health checks (eyes, hips) done. A good breeder will give you the third and fourth degree, and make you fill out a questionaire 5 pages long. They don't offer to just ship a puppy to the first person who forks over the dough. And they will have you sign a contract, and promise that they will always take the puppy/dog back at any time if you can't keep it. I'm going to repeat this. I posted it after I followed Ryan's picture link back to the breeder's website. Run, don't walk away from this "breeder"! Breeders don't charge extra for vaccines, "holding the puppy" (what, are they trying to get rid of them at 6 weeks old???), dog food, or beginning training while the pup is still under their care. There is no info on the dam and sire. No mention of health checks, etc. And that's all just for starters, I'm sure others will have more to add. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rskillz Posted June 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 I'm going to repeat this. I posted it after I followed Ryan's picture link back to the breeder's website. Run, don't walk away from this "breeder"! Breeders don't charge extra for vaccines, "holding the puppy" (what, are they trying to get rid of them at 6 weeks old???), dog food, or beginning training while the pup is still under their care. There is no info on the dam and sire. No mention of health checks, etc. And that's all just for starters, I'm sure others will have more to add. Point taken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rskillz Posted June 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 Simply looking for a pet BC. I will be super active with it, but it will NOT have a job to do and Agility training may be in the future, I'm not sure yet. I would love to see pictures. My email is Ryanskillz@gmail.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebecca, Irena Farm Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 Well, that was kind of an unsubtle puppy sale advertisement, which isn't actually allowed on this Board. Which is why we're all kind of dancing around your request to recommend a breeder, by the way, Ryan, not trying to be rude, just trying to go along with the spirit of this community, which supports rescue and responsible breeders strongly. I sent you a pm with some specific details, which you should have now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rskillz Posted June 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 Well, that was kind of an unsubtle puppy sale advertisement, which isn't actually allowed on this Board. Which is why we're all kind of dancing around your request to recommend a breeder, by the way, Ryan, not trying to be rude, just trying to go along with the spirit of this community, which supports rescue and responsible breeders strongly. I sent you a pm with some specific details, which you should have now. I completely understand and I think you all are doing great things. I was in no way trying to advertise that site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSnappy Posted June 12, 2007 Report Share Posted June 12, 2007 One thing I'd be worried about with getting a older BC or rescue dog is how it would fit in with the two dogs already at my home, the italian greyhound and black lab. Are BCs social dogs? Do they mix in with other adult dogs well? I figured a puppy would grow used to the other dogs by being around them from such a young age. Having fostered about 150 dogs, most of them adults, and nobody dying, clearly it is possible to add an adult to a home with existing dogs. A foster dog that has been in foster care with other dogs has already demonstrated the ability to live with other dogs. RDM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 Phew! I tried to read what everyone said and I hope I'm not repeating anyone else unnecessarily, but I have two bits of advice to add, for someone who is obviously genuinely interested in the advice the board has to offer. Thank you, Ryan, for being a good listener. 1. No one who has not already lived with a BC should start with a puppy. You will be in over your head -- I guarantee it. (I expect that AK Dog Doc will be along shortly to make this point firsthand.) Never mind all the advantages of getting paired up with an adult dog whose personality is already formed and matches yours. You just plain need to know a lot more about dog training than you currently do before you take on the challenge of a BC puppy. Find anyone who has raised a BC puppy and ask them if they disagree -- I bet they won't. 2. If one is choosing a puppy based on its lines, one needs to research the lines, not just the parents (i.e. check out the relatives for several generations back, and sideways if possible). We are learning more all the time about what aspects of a dog's temperament and abilities are inherited, and one of the things we are learning is that recessive traits that were not expressed in the parents often pop up in their offspring, if the traits were present farther back in the line. If you want to increase the odds of getting a "good" pup, you should make sure than none of the problem traits you don't want to deal with appeared anywhere in its lines. This, of course, assumes you know which traits you are after and which you want to avoid, and it assumes you know something about which traits seem to be inherited, all of which takes a good bit of learning to sort out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 Also, there's one important thing I forgot to mention. I live with two roomates and they both have dogs. An Italian greyhound and a Black lab. Both awesome dogs who are very sweet. How should that factor in? On the subject of integrating a carefully chosen puppy with the awesome resident dog, you might take a look at the following two threads: how did i know this was going to be a problem?? I need help and suggestions in light of your response roy is gone home Your experience could of course be different, but those threads at least portray a range of possibilities and responses to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkie Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 bc puppy is a headache....literally. for us its waking up 2-3 times a night cuz she woke up and needs some attention. what melanie said is very true too. my clover doesn't like to interact too much with other dogs; actually she likes to sniff them and when they get very close nose to nose its always a paw whack in the face. even though she gets reasonably well with my lab she can become a major pain in the @ for skye. she would rather observe whatever skye is destroying and playing for her is chasing skye around the backyard. the chunky skye's runs around the backyard at ~20mph, but clover's really got the brain never chasing at the end, always taking shortcuts [edit] we adopted both of ours from saturday morning shelters in front of petsmart. not regretting though (the headaches will pay off ) and WILL adopt one from shelter again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack & Co. Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 Take a look at the gorgeous red BC that Debbie (TheRuffMuttGang) has up for adoption! http://www.bordercollie.org/boards/index.php?showtopic=12484 Debbie is in Texas which is probably too far out of the way for you, but he is stunning! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amc Posted June 13, 2007 Report Share Posted June 13, 2007 Hey Ryan, You could swing by Garland on your way to Georgia..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.