Grumpy at Agility class

[hoku's mum]

Well, we finally have started agility class (yippee!!! only one person teaches around here, and only in summer, luckily we really like her a bunch). The first two classes were fantastic, Hoku had a blast, was a model citizen. Last week, he started growling and lunged at a couple of dogs in the class.... makes it hard to have fun and be all happy-happy upbeat with your dog being a butt head . He has a history of this kind of grumpiness on leash (he's fine off leash with other dogs) , he did it at first in puppy classes (with same teacher, so she knows him well), but with lots of work, he got over it, and I thought we were past it. I tried to keep good distance from other dogs as we did the drills, but sometimes other folks would let their dogs get into his space (what ever he decided that was at the moment), and he'd growl and lunge at them. A few times he lifted his lip at dogs in the vicinity for just being there. I was really trying to keep his attention on me, but he was so focused on EVERYTHING else, it was hard. I finally just pulled out of the line, and waited our turn off to the side, to give him more space. Still could not keep his attention for long, he was in orbit.

 

Anyone else have this issue, or any suggestions? I feel like I need some focus exercises with him. He's about 21 months old, I 'detonate' (read roar him around with his best buddy) before class, and use yummy treats that he likes very much. My feeling is that he is guarding me from the other dogs, but who knows?

Any thoughts are appreciated.

[MaggieDog]

Maggie can be like that as well - I just make sure everyone in class knows Maggie likes her space and do everything I can to increase the distance between us and the other dogs. I also work quite hard to keep her attention on me by asking for lots of tricks and giving good massages or playing tug and that seems to help a lot.

 

You might also try crating him until it is his turn as many dogs just get very overstimulated in an agility class, especially if dogs are running off lead.

[PSmitty]

This is why Jack doesn't do agility! It was a constant, very hard battle to get him through obedience, and I'm just not up to the challenge of agility with him. I have the feeling, though, that Hoku is not as bad as Jack, so take heart!

 

I like Erin's advice. Work with him on a "watch me" command to keep him focused on you. You can use the time you're waiting in class to work on his obedience (sits, downs) and teach him little tricks. And very important, just let everyone know Hoku needs his space.

 

Good luck! I bet he'll do fine.

[MaryP]

Oh yes, I know what you are talking about. That is Charlie. The more stimulating the situation, the more reactive he becomes. He's not a dog-aggressive dog at all, but in overly stimulating situations, which agility class is for him, he becomes agitated very easily and his personal space comfort zone expands quite a bit. I bring a crate to every class. If we have to wait for any length of time, I put him in the crate while we wait. My classmates, for the most part, have learned to keep their dogs out of Charlie's space. Of course, there's always that new person, or clueless person, who doesn't keep control of their own dog or thinks it's perfectly OK to let their dog walk right up to Charlie, even though they see me constantly moving away when they get too close. If our wait is short, I just keep Charlie's focus on me by making him run through all his tricks and commands. In fact, I try to teach him a new trick every week or so, just so that he doesn't get bored with the same old tricks all the time. If it's possible, I will also try to seek out a quiet, uncrowded area, where we can stand during class. The less commotion going on around him, the calmer he is. Usually, as we go through class, he also starts to calm down a bit, as he expends some of that excited energy. The biggest thing I think, is to recognize the potential problem before it happens so that you can avoid it. I agree, it's a pain in the butt to have to manage a dog like that. I'd much rather be able to just enjoy being in class without having to be on constant guard, but I think with intense dogs like BCs, this is not an uncommon problem.

[TheStacks]

Zoey acted this way when the other dogs would get their turns in class. Can we say WAY overstimulated? Most of her actions I think were due to misplaced aggresssion/excitement that someone else was getting a turn.

 

I too worked on watch me and had high value treats. Focusing on me helped and tugging did as well. By the end of each class I was mentally and physically EXHAUSTED from trying to keep her focused on me, working with her on the different lessons, and trying to pay attention to the instructer/others in the class.

 

Agility turned out to be good for our focus work. Let's just say an agility career is not in her future.

[hoku's mum]

So, I am on the right track with (trying to) keeping his attention on me and space around him. Lauren, I know what you mean about exhausted, I was so wiped out at the end of that class, with the tension of trying to keeping his attention, knowing where all the other dogs (and one very ditzy and distracted handler... there's one in every group, no?) were, and listening and absorbing what the instructor is saying, AND be happyhappy .

 

I'll try more tricks and maybe the tuggy game, just don't want to amp him up any more. At the class he seems to direct his over stimulation to hyper focus on everything around him (the other dogs, squirrels in trees oh joy, the guy mowing next door, the person walking by, the birds over head, flys, you name it, just not Mom!)

 

I don't see a career in agility for him. but it is big fun, and would like to be able to hang in the classes long enough to learn so we can play at home, and maybe some fun matches. Glad to hear it's not just us, that is a help!

[Barb Scott]

At an area obedience class, a woman was very successfully using meat flavored baby food (her dog licked it right out of the jar) to keep her reactive dog's attention on her and not on other dogs in the class.

Barb S

[clara]

It is good to know that others have the same issue! Ling was the same way but has mostly stopped any reactive behavior. It took about two years of agility class 1-2x a week, but she is calm and mostly ignores other dogs now. I did exactly what other people have suggested, used a crate when I could and high value treats to keep her attention on me when she couldn't be in her crate. I put a stinky liver treat in my fist with my fingers spread so she could get at it with her tongue and kept my hand right in front of me, telling her "look". Three years ago she could barely walk through a typical agility trial without growling at someone, and now we can walk through a crowded room full of dogs and she keeps her eyes on me. You'll get there and you'll be SO proud of him! It's almost better than being really good at agility!

[shanni and kingsley]

actually.. kingsley is like that in class too.... being very snappy with dogs that invade his space... and he oftens target certain breeds.

 

posted up previously too... and i am working on it.. seems that he is getting better!

 

just to add, i went for a agility workshop today with a trainer who owns bcs.

 

she told me something that made a bit of sense.. i don't know if any of you share the view.

 

her theory is that bcs are bred to be very fast and reactive. and in their doggie mind, they think that all others should be the same way.. hence, they often the first to react in any situation hoping to get a reaction from the other animals, be it sheep, cattle or even other dogs. And get the blame for starting fights.

 

and bc naturally doesn't like certain breeds cos of their natural breeding.

eg. huskies cos of their mane and fur.. threatening the bcs

boxers cos of their bulging eyes..

 

not that i am condoning a growly dog's behaviour.. but just tot that it was interesting.

[hoku's mum]

Thanks for the replies, all, it's just good to know we can work this through! How does anyone feel about correcting him for the lip lifting? I think once he lunges, it's to late for correction, but I am torn with trying to keep it all super fun, and thinking a quick leash correction and 'knock it off' at the first signs of lip lifting could get the message to him. We are about 95 percent positive training, but are willing to use corrections when needed. Any thoughts?

[berocca]

Cody used to be the same way at agility. Then one day he snapped at the instructors dog (which was entirely his fault might I add), Cody was already in a stay and I was heading to where I was going to start when the instructor walked his dog right behind Cody (actually stepped over his tail). I could see Cody trying to refrain but I couldnt get back to him to praise him for it before he turned and snapped at the dog. Didnt actually connect with her, just a "get out of my space" action but it scared the other dog that much she sulked all night, refused to do anything, and ended up being put in the car. I started muzzling Cody about then as a precaution in case he took that next step. He was fear aggressive so he wouldnt target dogs, but would get in first if another dog invaded his space and seemed threatening. I was absolutely amazed at how he improved after that. I used the muzzle for obedience as well and he was a totally different dog. He was much calmer and he didnt get agitated in class anymore. One of the trainers said that she had seen many dogs calm down with a muzzle on and one of the trainers already muzzled her dog. The best part about it though- idiots stopped coming up and letting their dogs play with "the poor dog standing over there all by itself". I think thats what made the difference. By having a muzzle on people gave him the distance he wanted (for him that was about 1m all around him).

 

Other than that I found that really keeping him busy (lots of random party tricks) while waiting for our turn gave him something else to focus on.

 

I learnt to read Cody's body language well and if he started lip lifting I gave a quick "UH" noise and he usually stopped. You can only do so much "good boy for being still, good boy for not eating that dog, etc". Sometimes you need a quick throat noise to pull them into line then you can praise them for stopping the antisocial behaviour if you know what I mean.

[PSmitty]

Thanks for the replies, all, it's just good to know we can work this through! How does anyone feel about correcting him for the lip lifting? I think once he lunges, it's to late for correction, but I am torn with trying to keep it all super fun, and thinking a quick leash correction and 'knock it off' at the first signs of lip lifting could get the message to him. We are about 95 percent positive training, but are willing to use corrections when needed. Any thoughts?

 

I don't see any problem with correcting the lip lift, to keep it from escalating to a lunge. If he's just being "a jerk", I'd give a small tug to get his attention and tell him to quit it. Go from that to a quick "watch me" and treat.

 

My Jack is fear aggressive, so this might not work with him, but I think from the sounds of it, would be fine for Hoku.

[Barb Scott]

If you correct the lip wiggle, your BC may just skip that and go right into attack mode.

Barb S

[nowwown]

We've learned that our Cody (not the same one as poster above) will focus a lot on a tennis ball while we're waiting for our turn. He has been prettty agressive with one dog at agility class, plus he will jump and grab at the leash all the time as I think he's overstimulated there. But the ball being thrown to him from even a foot away, and he catches it and drops it for another throw) really keeps him calmer and focused on my daughter who is doing the Agility class with him.

 

Hope this suggestion helps! Thanks to other posters here on this topic/thread, as I learned a lot also!

[hoku's mum]

Quick up date, we had class again tonight, and Hoku did much better, with all the great suggestions here. We really worked on focus on me, doing tricks, and asking the clueless is the class to please keep their dogs noses out of Hoku's butt. He did one grumble, (when aforementioned dog just got to personal) but we just quickly moved away and refocused. It was fun, exhausting, but fun! Thanks for the great thoughts and ideas, you all are the best!