I'm worried about Jack

[WyoBC]

Yeaterday Jack started to act like he did about a week and a half ago when I took him to the e-vet because he was acting really weird and wouldn't let me touch him or pet him. He has been doing it all day today again. He doesn't want me to pet him or even touch him but then if I do go to pet him he'll whine and roll over on his side, or just hide in the corner. I was thinking maybe it was the Meds I was giving him for his shoulder? He was on them for two weeks when he did it the first time, then off of them for two days to see if it would help. He was back on them and pretty much normal for about a week then right back to doing it again. I'm so worried about him, and for the life of me I can't figure out what I'm doing if it's not the meds that's making him like that. Maybe it's just me? He's been coming to my Mom all day but it's off and on if he'll come to me. I just don't know what to do. The vet said they couldn't find anything wrong last time, so it's probably just a thing he does. I want him to be happy so bad but I don't know what to do. I have been stressing about it since last night when he started cowering down to me again. I have thought about everything over and over again in my head all day. I don't know if anyone can help or not. I just feel so bad when he whines and cowers down everytime I go over to see him. I just want to hug him again without him whining

[Black Watch Debatable]

Shot in the dark --- are you wearing anything different? Is your behavior different --- wearing an iPod, say --- from when he isn't anxious? Anything different in the house? My first dog used to freak out at the sound of canned laughter on sitcoms... she'd run and hide. Good luck --- I hope things change for the better.

[kaos]

my one dog will freak if she smells burning anything (including bbq) or hears the beep beep of any alarm (think fire alarm or clock radio) my other dog, is terrified of balloons.... took us a bit to figure it all out, but now we can be proactive about helping them deal or just plain avoid their triggers.

Sara

hope you find some answers soon, its not fun trying to figure out these things, don't you just wish they could speak english sometimes?

[SincereArtisan]

Well over a year ago, I adopted a BC mix, named Raven. Raven had spent the majority of her life as a stray, and was just learning that humans were not to fear. I recieved some very awesome advice after bringing her home.

 

She was timid, shy, and I wanted to promote her eagerness to be loved and desire for attention. When I would reach to pet her, and she'd shy away. If I moved too quickly, she'd shy. Sometims she'd roll, submissively. She wanted the attention, because if I cooed to her she'd get all squirmy and I could eventually get her closer.

 

I soon learned, though, thanks to people on here, to ignore her shy behavior. She wanted the attention, so I made her work for it. If she shied, I would withdraw my hand, turn away and leave the room. Eventually, she followed! Padding behind me, tail wagging, to nudge her nose under my hand, wich I would reward with a pet and much fuss. Basically, if she acted shy or withdrawn, I would ignore her....she didn't want that! So she had to approach me, become more outgoing, for the attention she so greatly desired.

 

Coddling Jack's shy, withdrawn, funny behavior is in a sense, rewarding him for it. If he learns he gets great attention and fuss over acting so weird, then he's going to keep it up. Heck, so would I!

[Root Beer]

Coddling Jack's shy, withdrawn, funny behavior is in a sense, rewarding him for it. If he learns he gets great attention and fuss over acting so weird, then he's going to keep it up. Heck, so would I!

 

Please be careful about taking the position that your dog is acting this way for attention. While it can happen, there are also times when the dog is really trying to communicate something and there is a real risk of breaking down the trust that your dog has for you if you expect your dog to just kind of "shape up" and start acting "normal".

 

If there are underlying fear issues in Jack's behavior, "coddling" can't reinforce it.

 

I went through a situation just over a year ago where Speedy suddenly developed a fear of German Shepherds and dogs barking at him from crates. At first I took the attitude of "he has to suck it up". I wasn't mean or harsh with him, but I didn't give him any reassurance or help with his fears - I turned my head away when he acted fearful and ignored him expecting that would teach him that acting afraid wouldn't get him attention. BIG MISTAKE. The problem got worse and he started to run to other people when he felt fear or pressure. When I realized that I had lost his trust, I set out to rebuild it and began to reassure him. When he was fearful, I sat next to him on the floor and petted him quitely. Gradually he started to look to me again and we rebuilt his trust very slowly.

 

It turned out that the behavior that I thought he was "faking" to get attention was a real cry for help from him. He needed me to be there. I learned that I'd rather err on the side of "rewarding withdrawn behavior" than risk not being there for my dog when he needs my support. It took many, many months to restore his willingness to trust me when he's afraid.

 

I just feel so bad when he whines and cowers down everytime I go over to see him. I just want to hug him again without him whining

 

I would try this. I would get something absolutely delectable (like roast beef or chicken or something), sit on the floor and put a piece of the food on a plate about 3 feet away from me. As he walks over to eat it, I would look away just slightly (keep him in your peripheral vision, though). I wouldn't say anything - no praise, not his name, nothing! After he eats that piece, I would place another one there. I would repeat this five or six times and quit. If he didn't have a problem taking the food from the plate, I would repeat the process a couple of hours later.

 

When not in this process, I would leave him to feel out what he is experiencing. If he were to approach me, I would very quietly say "good boy", but I wouldn't try to pet him at all for a while. If he likes toy play, I would toss a toy every now and then, but I wouldn't press the issue of physical contact for now.

 

The next day I would see if he would take the food right from my hand. Again, I would sit on the floor as I do this. If he won't, I would use the plate again, but put it slightly closer and gradually move up to having him take the food from my hand.

 

Once he was doing that consistently, I would add in some very, very quiet praise as he takes the food. I would avoid the squeaky "fake happy" type of praise. A nice quiet "gooooood" is a lot less likely to make him feel startled or pressured.

 

After that, I would try to place a hand gently on the side of his neck as he takes the food. If he were to shy away, I would just give the food for a while more. If he were receptive to the soft touch on his neck, I would move to gradulaly petting him on the neck, on his back, the back of his head, etc. I would feed all the while.

 

If I found during this process that he suddenly became receptive to being petted and hugged again, I would still work this exercise daily for a long time to really reinforce the fact that me touching him is a good thing and that there's no pressure. I would gradually shift into giving him a daily massage and continue that (even if for 5 minutes a day).

 

I would expect to find that after a short time, he would start to solicit attention and then I would start to give him that attention very quitely. I wouldn't worry at this time about the dog developing habits of trying to get attention all the time - you can train alternate behaviors to fix that later if it happens.

 

If I found that he didn't make any progress through this process, even slow progress, I would consider consulting a behaviorist. But I would try this process of desensitization and counter conditioning first. Especially since he is receptive to being petted by your mother.

 

I've seen it work wonders. Speedy can dance at competitions now where there are dogs barking from crates and German Shepherds walking by. Sometimes he still needs me to kneel beside him to let him know I'm there. Sometimes he needs the reassurance of the clicker and treats. But he's not cowering in the corner shaking - not by a long shot!

[sandra s.]

My first dog used to freak out at the sound of canned laughter on sitcoms... she'd run and hide.

 

I applaud her taste .

 

Kessie was fearful at first, too (never as bad as your poor Jack, though). I found the book "Calming Signals" by Turid Rugaas pretty helpful. Not a cure-all, but I was grateful for the additional ways of trying to get peaceful intentions across, especially in narrow/close situations where a shy dog is uncomfortable even with a "softie" like me (or you ).

 

Just another example of things Kessie worried about:

Many people insist that dogs don't have a sense of "having done something wrong", but for the first few weeks Kessie would have occasional accidents in the house and she was absolutely mortified. She'd come grovelling and pleading BEFORE anyone discovered the poop. I think she had been housetrained in a brutal way by her previous owner and expected punishment. She even tried to hide her "accidents" by going in a dark corner (and yes, I stepped right in it one morning!).

I've no idea if Black Jack has such expectations of punishment from his old home, or what he might expect to get punished for - just throwing around ideas...

 

Good luck with finding the reason for his behaviour! It's heartbreaking to see them scared without any reason.

[smileyzookie]

Sandra, Riven does that as well!!!! Last night one of the 2 poo'd on my living room carpet... not sure which one. But she acted as if she did it and was cowering before I even saw it... thats right, even when Rohan does the bad deed she cowers like she's in trouble.

 

As for Jack, I agree with SincereArtisan. I dont think he's trying to get attention, but I do think that you shouldnt reward it. So following that line of thinking, I dont think there is anything one bit wrong with Kristines idea of how to build more trust. EXCEPT I dont agree that you should pet the dog when its fearful, IMO and how I believe it just says to Jack that its ok to be afraid. So in case I havent thoroughly confused you, I think that you should not ignore the behavior, but not be offended by it (for lack of a better word, you know what I mean right?). Jack can pick up your body language and your energy. By putting of energy that you feel sorry for him or sad or whatever, it makes it harder to trust you....

 

I hope all that made sense.

[sluj]

Along the lines of what Luisa and Sara suggested, you might try keeping a journal. Record everything going on when this occurs: weather, time of day, sounds smells, anything you notice. Obviously we hope this doesn't reoccur, but if if does, you'll have an easier time detecting a pattern.

[Dixie_Girl]

AJ, I know this is frustrating to you. And add the fact that he is a rescue, therefore you don't know what he did or didn't go through, makes you want to think it is something that may have happened before you got him. And that may well be the case. But it may not. I have had Jackson since he was 7wks old. I know what he has experienced. When he was a pup, he got lots of cuddling. Eventually, he could not handle that. He is just not a cuddly dog! Skip on the other hand, lives to get cuddles! When he gets scared or someone scolds him, he runs to me to get reassurance cuddling. When Jackson is faced with the same thing, he runs to his "den", which is under the dining room bench(we have one of those corner table things). When he is fearful, he wants his den, when he is stressed, he wants his den! There are only two times when you can cuddle with him. In the morning, if I haven't gotton out of bed yet, and at night when I first get in bed. And then, it is just for a short amount of time! I would give anything to be able to cuddle and hug on him, I love him so much, BUT it is just not his cup of tea! So, I cuddle with Skip and leave Jackson alone. Just like some people are "touchy-feely" and some are not, so it is with dogs. If he was not like this when you first got him, it is probly because he was so happy to be out of the shelter he didn't want to upset his good fortune! It is probly because he DOES trust you now and is comfortable with his life that he feels he can let his "real" feelings be known! As for him letting your mama touch him, well, that is part of the quirkiness of dogs. There is one person that can hug on Jackson at any time, my grandson! ( he lived with us from the time when we brought Jackson home.). Just like when we have kids, we have certain ideas on how we want them to be. Invariably, it will usually be just the opposite! So it is with dogs. If the vet finds nothing wrong with him, I would just let him have his space. They all have their ways of loving us, we just have to accept that, or get a stuffed dog! Be patient AJ, y'all will find your rhythm and be very happy.

[Kyrasmom]

I don't remember, when you took Jack to the vet, did they run blood work as well? My Samoyed had attacks of pancreatitis and that's exactly what they looked like. In fact, she would lie down and cry in the middle of walks and we didn't know what the heck was going on. One vet diagnosed disc problems.....it was over 2 weeks later that a proper diagnosis was made. Just a thought.

 

If it is behavioral, or there is no physical ailment to work with, then many of the tips posted above are excellent. I don't necessarily coddle fear but if I know what my dog is afraid of, I will put myself between him and the trigger and act very normal. That is very reassuring for a dog and yet you're not necessarily reinfocing his fearful reaction.

 

Good luck!

Maria

[smileyzookie]

I also second what Maria said. Gosh so much good advice AJ!! Let us know how its goin today.

[PSmitty]

I don't have any better advice, AJ. It's so hard to tell if it's a physical or emotional reaction that Black Jack is having. I have a fearful dog, and I know how hard it is to deal with. You've gotten great advice already, so I'll just add my best wishes.

[BayouBC]

I don't know what type or brand of medication Jack's on (I'm sure I missed it somewhere), though I'm guessing some sort of pain med. While this would be an odd reaction to a medication, who's to say that it's -not- related? Plenty of people react differently to medications. Some make people more anxious, sensitive to touch/light/etc, and so on. People and dogs are obviously different when it comes to medications, but those sorts of reactions also aren't something a dog can really reveal during drug trials.

 

So considering the timing with the medication and these "episodes", you might talk to the vet and see if they can change the medication he's on. If the problem stops, then maybe it was the med. It's a pretty easy thing to try and an easy solution if it works. If he's on some sort of pain medication, then there are definitely plenty of alternatives to try.

[WyoBC]

Thank you guys for all the info and help. I really appreciate it. I'm handling it a little bit better now, not as much stress now I guess.

 

He's a little better now but he's been off his meds for three days now. He'll let me pet his head and he kind of comes up to me to get a hug. Maybe it is that he's starting to let me know how he really feels. Maybe he doesn't like hugs all that much. What's funny is when we're out for walks or out playing he's pretty much the happy go lucky Black Jack I know, but when he comes into his porch, or the house he changes. Gets shy and kind of fearful.

 

Kyrasmom, what was wrong with her? The vet said that his back seemed sore. They haven't run any blood tests yet. I might have them do some when he gets his shoulder checked this Tuesday.

 

He was on Rimadyl twice a day for the pain. Last time he was off of them for two days and he got better, and he does seem to be better today.

[Kyrasmom]

My dog had pancreatitis, which is a painful and potentially dangerous inflammation of the pancreas. They can have bouts of it so if misdiagnosed it can seem to go away.

 

Bloodwork can confirm it so I would ask for a panel just to be on the safe side...however if it happens only in localized areas it could very well be behavioral or by association. I know that once diagnosed diet became pretty important to avoid any fatty food etc etc. I don't know that Rimadyl would hurt as my dog was on and off of it without issue but you never know as every dog reacts differently to meds. It's worth a question to the vet IMO.

 

I hope you'll update us as you know something.

 

Maria

[Tracey M.]

It's a long shot, but is there any chance that Black Jack may have been "zapped" by static electricity? If, for instance, you scuffed your feet on the carpet and then touched him, he might become fearful of your touching him. This problem could come and go with weather changes, and would usually be better outside than in. Just a thought...

 

Tracey

[Beth G]

My last dog also had pancreatitis. It is so painful for them. And then to top it off she was misdiagnosed with colitis so they put her on an even fattier food!! This made it way worse. She cringed often with that disease as it hurt her so bad.

[WyoBC]

I think I will have his blood checked. I have a dentist appt. tomorrow so I'll take him in Tuesday. He seems to be getting better today. He's letting me pet his head and back some now, not as much inside but he's getting better. He was playing and running around today during chores.

 

I hope it's not anything to bad so he doesn't have to go through more.

 

I got to thinking, could it be that he couldn't play much for four weeks? He's not really like most BC's as far as bounching off the walls, but since he was just getting into playing maybe after four weeks of not doing much he was getting depressed? It seems like the more I play with him the better he gets. So I'm trying to play with him but not to much either so it doesn't hurt his shoulder.