demodex just won't get better

[fotobridget]

Liberty's hair continues to fall out, though the vet said her skin was actually looking good. That was last monday and we only have two doses of antibiotics left and her hair is thinnning daily!

 

but her skin isn't nearly as red.

 

I am getting more and more worried. I have had her since January 22 and literally every two-three weeks we are at the vet's office.

 

Anybody else been through this? Any suggestions?

[Nik]

Are you sure its demodex? Did your vet do a skin scraping to verify? If so, I'm afraid antibiotics aren't going to cut it. Not to get rid of the mites anyway. You have several options though so don't lose hope. You could try Amitraz dip (which I definitely wouldn't recommend unless there's no other alternative...I went that route first and it definitely wasn't a good outcome), you could try Ivermec (that's what was the best option for us) or you could try the holistic approach (others w/ experience will have to chime in for this approach).

 

When I started Pache on the Amitraz, he had severe allergic reactions to it and I had to dose him up on Benedryl before dipping him. I couldn't put him through that anymore so I talked to my vet about the Ivermec. I had Pache tested for the MDR1 gene and his tests came back negative. Started him on that, and within a month or so he was 100% better. Since then, he hasn't had anymore breakouts w/ the mites. Another way, if you don't want to send off the MDR1 gene test, is to start w/ the lowest dose and increase dosage to make sure your dog isn't sensitive to Ivermec.

 

It is something that is treatable, but not neccesarily curable. The best ways to prevent future breakouts is a good diet and keep the dog as stress free as possible. Hopefully some of this information is useful. I'm sure there will be plenty of the others who will chime in and give some more good ideas.

[smileyzookie]

I know nothing about it, I just wanted to say I hope you get some good info that will help cure the poor girlie.

[fooshuman]

Does Revolution work on demodex like it does sarcoptic mange? You might ask your vet about it. My vet refused me anything but dipping. It sucked for all of us, but after the 3rd dip things cleared up nicely. Sorry I don't know much about Demodex other then it sucks! If you haven't tried Paramite you might also ask your vet about it. The stuff is 100% pure nasty, but it works! Again I am not sure if these products work on Demodex like they do sarcoptic.

 

Goodluck and best wishes.

Foo's

[PSmitty]

I'm assuming if your dog is on antibiotics, you're treating a secondary skin infection? Antibiotics don't actually treat the mange at all.

 

I'm sorry, I can't remember your situation...how old is the dog? How are you treating, or are you treating, the demodex itself? Have you had a positive skin scraping?

 

I also battled demodex with Jack. I successfully treated it with no chemicals or dips (like Amitraz, which my vet said he had never seen work, anyway).

 

The biggest thing to understand is, it's an immune system problem. The best thing you can do is boost the dog's immune system! This is crucial. Some puppies recover with no treatment at all, as their immune system matures, but it sounds like Liberty needs some help. Also, stress brings it on, so you want to do your best to avoid that, including any kind of surgery (spaying) and vaccinations during treatment.

 

Here's what I did with Jack: Boosted his immune system with lots of rest, fresh air, good food and vitamins/supplements. I gave vitamins C, E and A, salmon oil and also zinc. I rotated through a few supplements: astragalus, echinacea, pau d'arco, Modcare and colostrum.

 

Jack's was generalized, which means it was all over, not just a patch or two. He got a bath with a benzoyl peroxide shampoo, followed by a rinse of diluted tea tree oil, several times a week. You can also use a lemon juice rinse instead.

 

I did the baths for about a month, I think. The supplements, longer, several months, at least. Just remember to rotate the immune boosting supplements every couple of weeks (astragalus, echinachea, pau d'arco, colostrum). I will tell you, this was not a fast cure, but I felt best treating it naturally. The mange never developed into secondary skin infections or massive hair loss, which I atribute to the way I treated it, IMO.

 

Google "natural treatment of demodex mange" and you will find lots of good stuff out there.

 

Best of luck to you and Liberty!

[Olivia]

I don't think Revolution works on demodex. The best treatment I've ever seen work is the Ivermectin by mouth.

 

At the clinic I used to work at we had a shi tzu that was 10 years old that had had generalized demodex for it's entire life. She had practically no hair and her skin was so swollen and infected that you couldn't see her paw pads or eyes. If you pressed on any part of her skin, even to just pick her up, she would scream from the pain, try to bite us, and pus would ooze from her skin. She was in incredibly bad shape. Her owners had tried dips, holistic treatments, basically everything their vet had told them to do. Then they came to us for one last opinion before putting her down. We put her on Ivermectin and antibiotics immediately. She started improving the first week, the swelling started going down and her skin started looking healthier. The vets didn't think she would grow back a full coat, they said that the hair follicles were probably so damaged by the years of infection. After a month she was still bald but had turned into the sweetest little girl. She felt soooo much better.

 

I didn't see her again for about 9 months but when I did I didn't recognize her at all. She had a full coat with a little bow on her head. She was smiling and running around like a puppy. I can't imagine the horror of her life until that point but I know the rest of it was roses.

 

I would say to not give up with Liberty. Keep trying things until you find what works. If your vet is reluctant to try the Ivermectin or another alternative treatment, find another one who will listen to you and work with you.

 

Olivia

[Rebecca, Irena Farm]

I highly recommend oral ivermectin as well. I had a rescue here a couple of years ago with generalized demodex. It was really easy to treat, but it was a maintenance thing - we treated her for two months and by the time she went to her new job, she was still getting ivermectin every three days. That was down from every day, so I assume she'll eventually go off it, but it shows you how long it can take, and how much it can take sometimes.

 

The cattle wormer we used is CHEAP compared to dipping, and far more effective and safe. If your vet won't let you do it, find one that will.

 

I also agree with boosting her immune system.

 

Good luck!

[Lisa Smith]

When Deuce was a puppy she had a lot of hair loss on the inside of her back legs and on her face...my vet put her on Revolution and within a month she was growing the hair back and hasn't had a problem since...

[fotobridget]

I'm assuming if your dog is on antibiotics, you're treating a secondary skin infection? Antibiotics don't actually treat the mange at all.

 

I'm sorry, I can't remember your situation...how old is the dog? How are you treating, or are you treating, the demodex itself? Have you had a positive skin scraping?

 

I also battled demodex with Jack. I successfully treated it with no chemicals or dips (like Amitraz, which my vet said he had never seen work, anyway).

 

The biggest thing to understand is, it's an immune system problem. The best thing you can do is boost the dog's immune system! This is crucial. Some puppies recover with no treatment at all, as their immune system matures, but it sounds like Liberty needs some help. Also, stress brings it on, so you want to do your best to avoid that, including any kind of surgery (spaying) and vaccinations during treatment.

 

Here's what I did with Jack: Boosted his immune system with lots of rest, fresh air, good food and vitamins/supplements. I gave vitamins C, E and A, salmon oil and also zinc. I rotated through a few supplements: astragalus, echinacea, pau d'arco, Modcare and colostrum.

 

Jack's was generalized, which means it was all over, not just a patch or two. He got a bath with a benzoyl peroxide shampoo, followed by a rinse of diluted tea tree oil, several times a week. You can also use a lemon juice rinse instead.

 

I did the baths for about a month, I think. The supplements, longer, several months, at least. Just remember to rotate the immune boosting supplements every couple of weeks (astragalus, echinachea, pau d'arco, colostrum). I will tell you, this was not a fast cure, but I felt best treating it naturally. The mange never developed into secondary skin infections or massive hair loss, which I atribute to the way I treated it, IMO.

 

Google "natural treatment of demodex mange" and you will find lots of good stuff out there.

 

Best of luck to you and Liberty!

 

 

 

So far we have Mitaban dips, we are on ivermectin (no signs of sensitivity-thank goodness!) and antibiotics for any underlying skin infections. We've switched foods and started vitamin suppliments. My vet also recommended staying away from anything containing nylon. The antibiotics have made her skin look much healthier--no horrible redness anymore.

 

Its just that her hair is thinning by the day. I don't know if it will all just fall out and regrow or if the problem is clearing up any.

 

Poor little doggie. SHe is only five months old. We just finished treating a nasty case of ringworm in February and now this.

[fotobridget]

I don't think Revolution works on demodex. The best treatment I've ever seen work is the Ivermectin by mouth.

 

At the clinic I used to work at we had a shi tzu that was 10 years old that had had generalized demodex for it's entire life. She had practically no hair and her skin was so swollen and infected that you couldn't see her paw pads or eyes. If you pressed on any part of her skin, even to just pick her up, she would scream from the pain, try to bite us, and pus would ooze from her skin. She was in incredibly bad shape. Her owners had tried dips, holistic treatments, basically everything their vet had told them to do. Then they came to us for one last opinion before putting her down. We put her on Ivermectin and antibiotics immediately. She started improving the first week, the swelling started going down and her skin started looking healthier. The vets didn't think she would grow back a full coat, they said that the hair follicles were probably so damaged by the years of infection. After a month she was still bald but had turned into the sweetest little girl. She felt soooo much better.

 

I didn't see her again for about 9 months but when I did I didn't recognize her at all. She had a full coat with a little bow on her head. She was smiling and running around like a puppy. I can't imagine the horror of her life until that point but I know the rest of it was roses.

 

I would say to not give up with Liberty. Keep trying things until you find what works. If your vet is reluctant to try the Ivermectin or another alternative treatment, find another one who will listen to you and work with you.

 

Olivia

 

 

I have a wonderful vet who is far less panicked over it than I! he is really great, answers all questions, is wonderful with all my animals--and only charges for the cost of medicine! Libby sure doesn't like visiting him though!

[Olivia]

Sounds like you have a good resource in your vet!!

 

Poor Libby though. Give her a kiss on the nose for putting up with all the Hoop-lah.

 

Olivia

[PSmitty]

So far we have Mitaban dips, we are on ivermectin (no signs of sensitivity-thank goodness!) and antibiotics for any underlying skin infections. We've switched foods and started vitamin suppliments. My vet also recommended staying away from anything containing nylon. The antibiotics have made her skin look much healthier--no horrible redness anymore.

 

Its just that her hair is thinning by the day. I don't know if it will all just fall out and regrow or if the problem is clearing up any.

 

Poor little doggie. SHe is only five months old. We just finished treating a nasty case of ringworm in February and now this.

 

I know it's so hard to see them like that!

 

Other than the dips, which I wouldn't do, sounds like you're on the right path. It will just take some time for her to beat it. I'd still look into boosting her immune system more, with the supplements I suggested. It certainly won't hurt or interfere with what you're doing now, and it might just be the boost she needs to start kicking it.

 

Not to be a downer, but Jack's hair never did re-grow to it's earlier thickness. I don't think that's the case with every dog, though, so don't give up hope!

[Meg's mum]

I don't think Revolution works on demodex. The best treatment I've ever seen work is the Ivermectin by mouth.

 

 

THIS IS NOT TRUE. Revolution is not indicated by the manufacturer for demodetic mange but it is definitely effective. I've had to deal with my Meg's demodex since we realized that was what she had in Novemeber. Ivermectin causes serious reactions in some collies so vets here do not prescribe it. When our vet said use Revolution I got the response from many that it wasn't effective. That was absolutely not true. It is used and prescribed and can be effective in treating collie demodex. It simply wasn't designed and tested by the manufacturer for that reason.

 

Meg's hair is almost completely grown back and the red is nearly enitrely faded now. Three months of once a month applications.

 

We were not prescribed antibiotics because those are clearly not effective on localized demodex without complications of secondary infections.

[Olivia]

Okay,

 

No need to shout. When I was in vet school we had a visit from the producers of Revolution who spoke about what it is indicated for and what it can also be used for that isn't on the box. They said very specifically that is can be used very successfully for sarcoptic mange and ear mites but not demodex. It should be used as two applications, 2 weeks apart when treating sarcoptic mange.

 

I'm glad it worked for Meg though. When the normal treatments don't work it doesn't hurt to think outside the box.

 

Olivia

[G. Festerling]

I too had just treated one with a bad case of demodex.

The Ivomec did the final trick. We weaned her on what turned out to be a large dose. For a rather long time.

She also gets the immnuneboosters like mentioned before. Now only about 3-5 times a week.

She is also on brewers yeast and yoghurt.

I read an article that recommended a yeast free diet but can't find it again....made a lot of sense however.

After a lot of experimenting with foods my kid is now on Diamond Naturals Lamb and Rice. It seems to work for her.

 

For the most part her hair came back just fine. It is not as thick as on some of my own. It is also not as long just yet.

But she has a tail again! On some parts of her body, where the scars were really bad she will probably never have any hair but those are very tiny areas.

 

Right now she is holding her own. I hope your kiddo gets lined out and gets to enjoy being a pup.

[fotobridget]

I know it's so hard to see them like that!

 

Other than the dips, which I wouldn't do, sounds like you're on the right path. It will just take some time for her to beat it. I'd still look into boosting her immune system more, with the supplements I suggested. It certainly won't hurt or interfere with what you're doing now, and it might just be the boost she needs to start kicking it.

 

Not to be a downer, but Jack's hair never did re-grow to it's earlier thickness. I don't think that's the case with every dog, though, so don't give up hope!

 

 

Libby's hair is short anyway. But I'm hoping something grows back soon. I need to call the vet and ask if i can use sunscreen on her poor little naked body. My boyfriend is threatening to get her some pants to wear--says the poor thing is embarressed not to have 'clothing' on her girl parts. Weird sense of humour, I know.

[fotobridget]

I too had just treated one with a bad case of demodex.

The Ivomec did the final trick. We weaned her on what turned out to be a large dose. For a rather long time.

She also gets the immnuneboosters like mentioned before. Now only about 3-5 times a week.

She is also on brewers yeast and yoghurt.

I read an article that recommended a yeast free diet but can't find it again....made a lot of sense however.

After a lot of experimenting with foods my kid is now on Diamond Naturals Lamb and Rice. It seems to work for her.

 

For the most part her hair came back just fine. It is not as thick as on some of my own. It is also not as long just yet.

But she has a tail again! On some parts of her body, where the scars were really bad she will probably never have any hair but those are very tiny areas.

 

Right now she is holding her own. I hope your kiddo gets lined out and gets to enjoy being a pup.

 

 

Libby's demodex is generalized. Her tail hair is very full and seems unbothered, her face is thinning and her legs and belly are bald. Luckily, though, when I took her in for her second set of shots in February she was just starting to develope the Demodex and my vet recognized it for what it was, tested for it and we started treatment. She has no scarring or pussing spots.

 

He recently prescibed the antibiotics to clear up any underlying infections and her skin is looking much less red.

 

But the poor little naked thing. Just breaks your heart to see her that way--but now i can easily count the freckles on her feet!

[Northof49]

Other than trying to kill the little devils off with drugs what else are you doing? Demodetic mange is also linked to a suppressed immune system, and so that needs to be addressed as well. You could try Astragulus to boost the immune system, as well as supplementing with Vitamin E, Vitamin C, etc. and food supplements rich in biotin.

[Nik]

Demodex is probably only 1 culprit to the hair falling out if you have been using the Mitaban dips also. I know the first time I dipped Pache, his hair just came out in clumps as I was dipping him. That was the first sign that I needed to really watch that stuff. The next sign was that night when his skin around his neck had swollen to the point of oozing fluid. That's when I called the emergency vet and they recommended the benedryl. After talking to my regular vet about it, we agreed to try one more time w/ the dipping but to dose him w/ the benedryl before dipping. After the 2nd time of dipping and he had lost even more hair due to the dip, we went ahead and switched to the Ivermec.

 

It took a few months after his treatments ended for the hair to come back in but it was still really sparse. That was about a 1 1/2 years ago...now he has a perfectly healthy and full coat. Hang in there, it may seem like it takes awhile, but chances are it will grow back.

[Kathy Chittenden]

We've had luck with the Preventic collar on foster dogs with demodectic mange.

 

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?cl...;articleid=1376

 

Kathy

ww.sugarbushfarm.net

[Guest pax]

Here's what I did with Jack: Boosted his immune system with lots of rest, fresh air, good food and vitamins/supplements. I gave vitamins C, E and A, salmon oil and also zinc. I rotated through a few supplements: astragalus, echinacea, pau d'arco, Modcare and colostrum.

 

 

I don't want to hijack the thread, but I've never heard of using colustrum in animals except within the first few weeks of life. I've used the first three, but I'd love to hear more about the colostrum if you feel like sharing. I wouldn't even know where to get it, for example, never mind for what.

 

For the OP: Good luck. Years and years ago I dealt with this and it sounds like you've got a lot more options these days, which is a big improvement. One thing that's food for thought is that hair grows for some time before it actually reaches its full length and then falls out naturally. Is it possible your dog's skin is much better and the hair coat is just playing catch up?

 

Cheers,

 

Celia

[fotobridget]

I don't want to hijack the thread, but I've never heard of using colustrum in animals except within the first few weeks of life. I've used the first three, but I'd love to hear more about the colostrum if you feel like sharing. I wouldn't even know where to get it, for example, never mind for what.

 

For the OP: Good luck. Years and years ago I dealt with this and it sounds like you've got a lot more options these days, which is a big improvement. One thing that's food for thought is that hair grows for some time before it actually reaches its full length and then falls out naturally. Is it possible your dog's skin is much better and the hair coat is just playing catch up?

 

Cheers,

 

Celia

 

 

Dont think so. Her hair seems to be thinning on her back tonite, where it was nice and full this past weekend. But now her little feet have stubble growing. Just don't know. I will try to remember to grab my digital camera and get some close ups of naked girl and post them in teh next couple of days.

[PSmitty]

I don't want to hijack the thread, but I've never heard of using colustrum in animals except within the first few weeks of life. I've used the first three, but I'd love to hear more about the colostrum if you feel like sharing. I wouldn't even know where to get it, for example, never mind for what.

 

For the OP: Good luck. Years and years ago I dealt with this and it sounds like you've got a lot more options these days, which is a big improvement. One thing that's food for thought is that hair grows for some time before it actually reaches its full length and then falls out naturally. Is it possible your dog's skin is much better and the hair coat is just playing catch up?

 

Cheers,

 

Celia

 

Celia,

 

Colostrum was recommended as an immune booster by someone who had treated several dogs for demodex. I don't know if it helped any more than the other supplements, but I figured it couldn't hurt, and she swore by it. I bought it in powdered form in the health food store. I guess people take it for various reasons? I can't remember the dosage now, I'm sorry. I think I used about 1/2 the human dosage recommendation.