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bc soul sista

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Posts posted by bc soul sista

  1. OH my...jeez. This pup was trained to heel this way USING a prong collar. She didn't yank the crap out of him until he started heeling like this. She started as a pup luring like most trainer do, rewarding for the right behaviors. The pup is HUGELY rewarded and encouraged to heel in a very animated way. The prong is used mostly for the attention aspect of it. I can assure you her dog LOVES to work and watching together as a team is truly awesome. She also trains for hunting as well.

     

    I guess I'll put another video up, same kind of heeling, not quite as bouncy but the weight is disributed on the rear...sorry for the whole vid, don't know how to edit it to just the heeling :s

     

     

  2. It's ok :) I'm sure from a stockdog background it seems quite silly. There are alot of different kind of heeling styles, my border collie heels completely different. We do attentive heeling also, but he is a bit longer in the body and it's not comfortable for him to have his weight on his hind end, head totally up heeling. But he still has total attention/focus/position..I just had to train him to "look" lower down on my body for a focus spot not up at my face/left shoulder like most obedience people prefer..

     

    I didn't mean to post the video to illustrate the difference in the "doggie activites"..I don't want to say herding is a sport because I guess I don't really consider it the same as the artificial "games" we play with our dogs(agility/obedience/etc.)...more just to show that Cedar is more than happy in his work and that using the prong as a training tool really is not causing fear/sulkyiness/etc..any kind of fear/stress based behaviors that someone who is not educated might think.

  3. K people, I'm just posting this vid..I am trying to mostly stay out of getting sucked into this. I think most people who are set in there ways about training a certain are convinced of it and will continue to do so...to each there own and that obviously works for them so great.

     

    What I am digruntled about is people taking it to the next level and actually condeming another method, saying it's abusive, etc.

     

    I wanted to post this vid of a friend and VERY accomplished competitive obedience trainer working her 10 month old lab puppy for attentive heeling using a prong collar...he is in no way shape or form being abused and looks happy to be working. No abuse here folks. Not to mention he is a lovely heeler. It took countless hours of correct training of course to get this...

     

  4. I would consider myself an awesome home for a dog...I currently have 3 dogs, one a rescue. Despit having kids and a busy schedule our dogs are a HUGE part of our family, they go to every sports practice/game, they get jogged and played with every morning, long hike or run after work. I do stockwork with the border collies 2-3 times per week, trials on the weekend..competitive obedience 1-2 times a week and trials..we EVEN took the dogs on our honeymoon..they are loved and HAPPPY!!!

     

    I also choose to use a prong collar from time to time, when training for obedience trials and or when situations arise like when my kids want to walk the dogs. It's for the safety of my kids, and for the dogs(so they don't pull and damage themselves)..

     

    I have Rarely encountered a trainer using correction based training. From my knowledge base, it just doesn't happen anymore. All the dogs, including mine are taught in a very controlled manner, where they know what a correction means. There is by no means any manner of abuse going on where a dog is drug or yanked or pulled all over the place with dog having no idea what is going on. People may pictue a fearful dog, cowering at some kind of abusive correction. This is simply not the case. I would go as far as to say if this is what someone really has come to with there experiences, they are either letting themsleves be overly influenced by some negative experieces and bad trainers, or they just haven't been training very long or with other knowledgable people.

     

    In learning how to train dogs for competitive obedience you need the dog to be animated/happy and focused in order to be competitive, if you think about it, using correction-based training would achieve the opposite results. which is why nobody does it anymore. The prong collar is a tool used by almost every trainer I know, some of them almost ENTIRELY positive otherwise...the key is good training, using is appopriately and TRAINING RIGHT so that the dog understands what it means.

     

    To say that I wouldn't be a good home for an adoptable dog because I choose to use these tools under certain context is sad. How close minded and judgemental can someone be.

  5. For regular "loose leash" walking I don't personaly use a prong..have been able to teach all my dogs/fosters with justa slip collar pressure/release...and lots of patience..but I don't hesitate to recomend them to people with pets who need more control over there dog. I promote the idea of doing whatever's necessary to keep dogs outta shelters and I think the prong collar is one of the more simpler tool to use and is very effective if used properly...

     

    I do however, use a prong for training for competitive obedience and the trainers I work with do also. Used as a tool for communication it's fitted snug and up right behind the ears, used mostly for teaching attention/heeling and keeping the head in the correct position..It's preffered BY FAR over the choke chain which I rarely see in training anymore. The prong seems to have more of an even pressure placement around the whole neck, more of a "grab" and when used subtly you can guide a dog with steady pressure if need be, or a quicker correction here or there..it makes timing easier also. Plus the dogs seem to take the various correction better since the pressure of tug of a prong IS more subtle and less traumatic as a JERK by a choke chain....

  6. I have 3 border collies and NONE of them want anything to do with the others..granted they were not raised together, but I find it interesting that none of them really seem to care about the others. All three are VERY obsessed with me and either spend there time following me around waiting for the next activity or lie in there own private area. In fact, my husband and I joke that each one has a scheming plot going to take out the others so they can be the only dog ;) LOL!!

     

    They are ALL VERY business like dogs!! They act like "playing" is so beneath them..total snobs :D I've taken them to dog parks and they just completely ignore other dogs and there attempts to interact with my dogs...I swear the other dogs are like.."Who brought the WEIRDOS!!!"

     

    I wish that they would play together sometimes, I think those are my own emotions coming into the equation though. Thinking that they would be happier by getting to frolick and romp with eachother, because that's what I think would make them happy. But in all honesty they really are probably %100 happy and fullfilled not doing so :)

  7. Well you're probably going to get a range of opinions of course, but generally not much of anything can be told at this point...I have rarely met a border collie who wasn't intersted in chasing sheep..it really doesn't mean anything..

     

    I had a well bred pup I brought up that was an absolute ALLIGATOR at 4 months old!! Would put him up for a month..try him again..same..would put him up again..same..he ended up in a pet home..

  8. I kind of find the whole "video titling" to be quite rediculous, what next?? They are making it possible for ANYBODY to say they have some sort of "title" now...with little effort at all..I actually kind of find it insulting for the people who have the talent and skill necessary to compete in live events.

     

    Everything ABOUT your training from the foundation skills up preps the dog to compete in live events, against other competitors. Otherwise you might as well be a petsmart APDT with a clicker, taking video of your "lure trained" puppy doing rally exercises in the control of your own living room.

     

    From the time you have a pup to be trained for performance events it all revolves around the idea you will eventually be in a highly distracting environment with situations you can't control. From the time you start teaching a prospective obedience dog to FOCUS, you will be spending %90 of your training efforts towards this which will be TESTED in competition. Your ability to train the dog and the dogs talent level aswell. In Agility also, the dog must be focused in LIVE instances. In herding, your skills will be tested on unkown sheep on a possible unknown field...ALL of you preperation leads up yto this.

     

    NOT to mention the hundreds of hours those of us put in traveling to other facilities..proofing, proofing, training, correcting, rewarding, proofing, proofing!!!! For herding, GETTING to other fields, practicing on different sheep...Well what's the point of all of this if you can just get some kind of recognition for doing this in your back yard??

     

    I hate to say it..but LIVE competition seperated the "men from the boys" so to speak people......It tests your ultimate talent as a trainer to prepare your dog and your dogs talent as well...

     

    I can understand if the dog has some physical(although I would like to add that I've seen dogs up to age 14 still joyfully competing in obedience and just saw a 12 yr old dog win an open sheepdog trial) or mental disorder that maybe prohibits it from live competition but I think most of it is the excuses of the owner. And most people who will do these "video" competitions are people that for whatever reason can't cut it LIVE and want to title chase..

  9. Hello There!!! I've recently finished my dogs CD obedience title, he did VERY well...all first places in some big classes....

     

    I have him trained through Utility and would like to start showing him for his CDX title next month...our main issue IIISSSSSS....fronts...and as anyone who has competed in Open knows...there are alot of them...I have tried all the "traditional" methods for tweaking the front...guide wires..backing up while fronting, working the circle and side passes...he gets his front perfect aboout %50 of the time..otherwise his butt is always out a shave to the side, enough for a point off...

     

    REALLY hoping someone with some experience might have any other suggestions???

     

    THANKS!!!!!

  10. Hello Maja,

     

    I have seen this exersice used in a couple different contexts...never in the one your trainer describes using it for though..

     

    I have seen two top trainers/handlers here use variations of this exercise for a couple different things...number one would be to teach a dog who is not covering properly to do so...This is done with the handler plastered to the end of a fence with the sheep in front of them...The handler asks the dog to flank and keep flanking aalllll the way around to the fence..in front of them and fly around to balance and stop...The dogs get all jazzed up and love it....helps keen them up a bit and get them excited about covering there sheep...when they flank and get to the rail the sheep will typicly move forward and the dog has to REALLY speed up...cover find balance and bring them back...

     

    The other version is not done on the rail...out in the open...and it's used to more "free up" dogs who have alot of the eye by forcing them to go past balance, speed up and flank freely instead of getting sticky...I am currently using this on my young dog...You flank the dog around then insist they whip around all the way past balance..in front of you and then back to balance...this takes quite a bit of pressure for a strong eyed dog and if he hesitates I get behind his hip and apply pressure....the dog should be booking at a good speed....

     

    Both of these exercises though...are done with the dog going in front of you...as you don't want them using you as a reference point....

     

    I wouldn't really encourage this exercise for a looser eyed dog who WANTS to flank and flank...and if I were you I would end the exercise with Bonnie at balance...and have her go in front of you not behind you..

  11. I have two dogs...with two different approaches to the "ball game"...

     

    My first dog i compete with in obedience trials and herding trials....he does EXACTLY what your pup does...in fact..when I let them out to go potty the first thing he ALWAYS does is run to the opposite side or "balance" as if the ball were sheep...about 20 feet away from the ball and lie there....he has done this since a pup...he also ALWAYS wants to drop the ball about 10-20 feet away from me...circle behind me...then do a perfect mini outrun again about 20-30 feet at "balance"...with me and the ball...

     

    The way I've managed this is by teaching him a HOLD command...did this as a seperate exercise...inside where things weren't so HIGHLY stimulating knowing he was going to play fecth with a chuck it...just takes some patience and alot of treats....a couple times a day I would do this...Chair out. Ball and hand full of treats in chair...get him to grab the ball, then I genlty put my hands over his muzzle, said "hold it" for a split second then "give" took my hands off...ball spit out treat...did this OVER and OVER and gradually increased time until he really understood what it means..then I would just practice it while watching tv whatever...have him "get it"..HOLD IT..."give" and treat..

     

    I also taught him Heel position seperatly...so when he is bringing the ball back to me when he is half way back I tell him HOLD IT..and HEEL....he comes perfectly into heel holding the ball until I take it from his mouth...I find that by GIVING him something to do before his brain kinda of takes over and goes into herding mode he GETS IT...If you let him kinda do his own thing he will do his wacky ball herding all day...I don't make him do the FORMAL HUNTING dog heel thing all the time..just here and there...but I use the hold quite a bit whne he wants to do his quirky thing..

     

    Another thing I have done with him is timed his herding behavior a bit...I can tell exactly when he is thinking about dropping the ball to early and if I give him a verbal correction or tell him to hold it he will be like "oh ya, sorry om forgot...was in my weird herding-ball mode" and will bring it all the way back....

     

    With my other older dog I bought recently and taught to fetch I don't care as much...I spent alot of patient time on the couch just NOT throwing the ball until he brought it all the way to me....he found out he didn't get to play the fun ball game until he brought the ball all the way to me...and turning in the other direction works for him...

  12. Alright...so I am in the process of learning my whistles...bought a trained dog who already has a set...I bring my whistle with on my ride to work every morning and practice, am currently using a Montana light whistle...

     

    #1 ISSUE) I am getting decent about getting a range of sounds out of the darn thing...doing them consistently and making the ones I want when I want them needs work...but my big problem is after about a minute I got so much SPIT in there I can't make decent sounds!!! I try clearing it out but I still can't get good sound!! It's all gurgly and NASTY!!! Is there something I am doing terribly wrong?? Would a different whistle be better??

  13. It seems like when I would correct him..it would make it worse...he also didn't seem to like me being closer to him..we were trying some parallel driving and it's almost like he thinks he is doing something wrong if I am putting that extra pressure on him?? Instead of seeing it as support?? Not sure if I am reading that right at all...

  14. Alright...question..

     

    When I'm working my dog on driving...he sometimes looks at me...occasionaly he will come off his stock completely and come towards me....he is a trained dog and trialed before succesfuly..so I don't think his previous owners were having this issue...I know I'm a novice and might not be making things clear to him..putting to much pressure on him or rattling off to many commands...

     

    It's freaking me out that he is coming off his stock though...big no no..I try to encourage him back on...sometimes it works immedietly...sometimes it doesn't..

     

    ADVICE PLEASE!!!!!

  15. Advise please...

     

    I mostly work on my own..bought a trained dog...had dog working GREAT for me months ago..super responsive..soft..liked to work a little tight at places but easlily took a verbal correction..would give to me..problem solved, kept working..

     

    Haven't worked sheep in months due to an injury..first time on sheep again. Dog NOT listening as well..not as responsive..made some verbal corrections, didn't really help. Biggest thing is the dog was working tight pretty much CONSTANTLY..seemed to forget what flanks/stops were..and he showed ALOT of eye...very sticky...on flanks and during driving..very slow...wouldn't release the sheep..

     

    I know what I need to do..just looking for some ideas on how to get it..I need to "soften" him up to me and "free" him up again...he was like this when I got him..so to do it myslef and get there again without screwing him up is my goal ;) I am a relative Novice..never run in anything higher than a novice course..my goal with this dog was to progress and hopefully make me a nice open dog down the road..

     

    One of his strengths was his responisveness to me..another trainer said "you could thread a needle with that dog" in terms of his stylish way of working and turn on the dime stops and turns with lighting-like efficiency..

     

    His weaknesses are..he tends to want to work to tight...and he doesn't have alot of natural "feel"....he is young though...only 3..was a pretty succesful nursery dog..

     

    Am I expecting to much from out first time working sheep in so long?? I am discouraged that I don't have the dog I did months ago...

  16. YES!!! He is already trained though Utility...we kinda wanted to get his CD over with..because open will be so much more fun!! And LOVES open work :D Hoping to tune up some heeling and compete for our CDX this fall...where this is a ton of big trials in a row around here!!! Does anybody else on these boards do obedience?? I am looking for experienced suggestions on tweaking his finishes...

  17. Had to share!!! SUPER excited!!!!

     

    My dog finished his CD last weekend, all first places with high scoring!! A half a point away from High in Trial!! DARN!!! So proud of my boy, he just LOVES doing obedience!! LOVES to work for me...he stayed focused and we had fun!! Here's to my best buddy!!!

  18. YES...doggie life jackets...I am getting to the point in my dogs rehab where he can start swimming...i am thrilled to almost have the clear to start building up his stamina again and getting him back in shape and swimming is an excellent way to do this :)

     

    With my other dogs it's not a problem...they will happily fetch a bumper at long distances in the water for hours!!! This dog...however...will not fetch...

     

    My friend lives on the lke and we have a canoe...so I am thinking of just swimming alongside of the canoe..gradually building up duration...I of course, don't feel comfortable taking him out in deeper water without a life jacket...I've never bought a life jacket for a dog...so would just like some recommendations??

     

    Are the more expensive ones really better?? I am looking for a good fit, plus comfort primarily...don't want him getting sore or not using his body right during swimming because of a cheaper ill fitting life jacket...

  19. Had an experienced person take a look at it before his Ortho appt Friday....doesn't seem to be a full rupture but possibly a partial tear....I've heard this is JUST as bad as a full rupture...that there is nothing that can be done about a partial tear...except for waiting for it to tear all the way so it can be repaired...

     

    This sounds horrible....can't imagine continueing to work my dog...waiting for the day for that ACL to fully tear and spend a butt-load of time and money fixing it...

     

    Is this the only solution to a partial tear??

     

    If he DOES have a partial tear is there any hope for healing, etc?? Any other options??

     

    I so appreciate expertise or experience in this area...

  20. New here...what are the signs/symptoms for a possible ACL injury..and what's the long term recovery/prognosis??

     

    My dog is favoring his back hind suddenly..puts weight on it and seems to get better the loonger he is moving...have an appt with an ortho vet in a week...but of course my stomach is in knots...

  21. Hi ALL!!!!

     

    New here!!! Just so thrilled with my bc thought I would share!!!

     

    Just had our first obedience trial last weekend!!! 2 days and 2 legs!!! 1st and 2nd place in novice out of some huge classes!! Almost 20 dogs in each!!! I am so thrilled with my boy :) He tried so hard and stayed focused on me the whole time!! Really put our trust and relationship to the test as you can prepare and prepare and still not know what's going to happen in the ring!!!

     

    Good boy :D And good girl to me for not passing out :D

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