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Posts posted by Smalahundur

  1. 3 hours ago, D'Elle said:


    I think border collies are very easy to train, but are a challenge to those who are inexperienced in dog training because it is so easy inadvertently to train them into something you don't want, even for someone who has experience in training. So, they are really easy and also not.

    Isn't everything easy when you know how to do it? I mean, I don't think raising a horse from a foal to a riding horse is particularly difficult. But guess what, I spend some decades gaining  hands on experience.(At the moment we have 7 horses on the farm at various ages).

    I agree in that I don't find training bordercollies very difficult. I do remember the learnig curve though,  pretty steep at times. But then I am talking mainly about the stockwork part

    I know someone ( the guilty shall remain nameless) that habitually ruins perfectly fine dogs because of his/her lack of experience combined with a strong resistence to be educated. Unless this person makes a basic chance in attitude there will never be a usfull dog on that farm. For people like that it will always be very difficult.(In this extreme case it is of course always the dog who gets the blame btw.)

    Imo bordercollies are more likely to become problem dogs beause of their drive and intelligence than a lot of other breeds. As a rule I don't advice people to get one (you know unless etc etc).

  2. 12 hours ago, Abroz said:

    Right. So we all agree that crates can be useful and are sometimes necessary. 

    How about if somebody comments on topic:  I posit that sometimes behavioral issues can also be addressed by allowing puppies more freedom, not less. Maybe sometimes we people would benefit from trusting our dogs more, not less.

    I'm not overly sensitive. Just trying to have a different conversation.  One that doesn't always end with "pop 'em in the crate" as the only answer.

    What are puppy steps that folks can use to expand their dog's freedoms and responsibilities? What are alternatives to time outs in the crate? Might it be a good idea to consider that a dog that won't settle is asking for a different kind of interaction? What might that interaction look like?

    I really don't see the logic behind your reasoning. "Expanding freedom and responsibilities" comes after having trained the dog, and you do that, by definition, by restricting the dog's freedom of behavior. You don't start to trust your puppy before you have trained him what it is you want him to do or not do. By the time I start to trust my dog and give it responsibilities it has reached an age I don't call it a pup anymore. I get the feeling this is trying to implement a good sounding philosophy without any practical method or value. In above post you put forward all kinds of questions you apparently don't have any answers for.


  3. I think you are going through a rather common proces as a starting handler; why does  lie down not always mean lie down? You see that with fully trained dogs handlers don't always reinforce the down, a standing stop or even just a slowing down can be satisfactory. Sometimes that is just what is needed depending on the situation, the sheep, the dog etc those different versions can all be fine. You don't want a robot, you want a dog that also thinks for himself, and that means (sometimes) allowing him to know better than to blindly obey you. Often he does!

    That said, personally, in the beginning of the training of a young dog I do demand and enforce a literal down when I ask for it. On the balace point to begin with to make it "easy" for the dog, more likely than not he will tend to spontaneous drop there. Also I try at that stage to avoid asking for a down when it is very unlikely an excited young  dog will take that command.

    To be able to release control over the dog you first have to have it I think.

    As so often "it depends"....Not easy, good luck (and fun!) with your training.

  4. Well,  " a sheep or two" obviously doesn't cut it. I'd say for training purposes you need at least three times as many.

    Furthermore, why does this particular dog need to work stock? I would be extremely apprehensive to allow a dog with the issues you describe anywhere near my sheep (and in the unlikely event not without a "sharkcage" to protect the livestock...)..

    My opinion is if you want to work stock you find a dog that is capable of doing that. Stockwork especially with a green dog is always stressfull (and sometimes dangerous) for the sheep involved. Why add to that equation a dog that has behavioral problems to begin with.

    As you see I am rather opposed to stockwork "for the benefit of the dog". Sheep aren't dog toys, or a therapeutical panacea for all kinds of bc behavioral problems.

    If you yourself have a burning interest in stockwork with dogs, go for it.  Find someone experienced, and let him assess your dog ( but be prepared to be dissapointed).


  5. I like your article. Good points.

    But the question if e collars have a place in stockdog- , or even general dog training is moot here in Iceland; their use is illegal.

    And even though I believe in competent hands, and for specific reasons ( again I agree not in stockwork) they can  have their use I still am happy with this ban.

    I have seen myself  how a complete idiot abused this tool, and it was not a pretty sight. This person would have been fully capable of screwing up her dog without it, but the e-collar enabled her to do this way quicker and more efficient....

  6. There is a lot wrong with inbreeding.  Just look at how all those pretty recently created  breeds are faring. Small genetic base, closed registry, just a big inbred mating party.

    Oh yeah, very consistent results, dogs that look like eachother's clones ( what a great breeding goal!), and off course all the genetic defects you can think of. Oh but we responsible breeders have tests for those! Pop! Oh noes, there's a new one! And ups,  another, well quick, more tests, and culling! We can defeat them!.:rolleyes:

    Good  old days, when the bordercollie was "just" a type, and not a breed. As far as I am concerned the best thing that could happen to dogs is the end of "pure breeding". 

  7. Yeah, that's inbreeding allright. Also watch out for the term " linebreeding", that is also a term for inbreeding used by people who don't want to call it what it is.

    What "counts" as inbreeding, or acceptable inbreeding varies wildly with what kind of breeder you talk to. Personally I do not want to see any inbreeding in my pups ( I don't breed myself).

    Can you return the pup? (Edit, looked at your other topic, looks rather hopeless.)

  8. Reasonable enough, sometimes you "pick your battles", and let something slide that is unwanted behavior, but not imported enough to put a lot of energy in ( we, or rather my daughter owns a chihuahua/pincher mix....:rolleyes:). But in case of the OP it was mentioned that this issue might lead to the rehoming of the dog when not resolved. That sounds like pretty important to me.

  9. Sounds like it went pretty good!

    The languages of my commands are a ridiculous mess:lol:, stockworkcommands mainly icelandic,  with some english ("down", "walk on") thrown in, and a couple of dutch, mostly daily life stuff ( bv. "aan de kant", "kom hier", etc).

    Ah well, at least there's whistles...

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